true believer
Well-Known Member
I'd be chuffed to see that side
Against the sheep shaggers
Against the sheep shaggers
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ROUND 16 - CCM V WSW
- Thread starter Forum Phoenix
- Start date
Luke
Well-Known Member
I must be in the minority thinking J.Rose was rightly dropped last night. He has been found out big time the last few weeks and has been behind the pace. He is clearly winding down which is sad because I love the bloke.
In saying that, Neil at LB failed again. He looks a totally different player and it's like he's never played there before. Cost us the second goal when he lost the ball out wide. Much better in midfield.
Storm with the obvious stuff up and not a great game again. Our LB and RB spot are an issue at the moment I think.
Izzo in for Bray has me stumped. Izzo should have done better for the second goal and was gernally poor all night with distribution and he always looks nervy. Bray showed in one game last week he commands his box, is confident, bosses his back 4 and has good distrubution. He should have started.
Stella was as I thought he would be. Just not up to it as a starter. Starting Fletcher after he hasn't played in a century baffles me. We looked much better when Bingham came on.
Monty with the unfortunate brain snap. The poor guy has been carrying the team all season and it's probably been one of the toughest seasons of his career. It was a shame because it cost us in the end.
Fab, Posco, Austin were good I thought.
Garcia.....class is permanent. If he can start and play 60 minutes for 6 or 7 games and we work out how to cover him when we lose the ball we won't get the spoon because he will create.
I haven't been overly critical of Walmsley yet because I think he has a really tough job that nobody else would willingly take on but last night he buggered the lineup and it failed.
My perspective take: WSW are a gun team this season and we beat ourselves more than anything. We go again next week and I'm looking forward to getting to Brisbane in 2 weeks because Berisha can't break my heart up there any more
In saying that, Neil at LB failed again. He looks a totally different player and it's like he's never played there before. Cost us the second goal when he lost the ball out wide. Much better in midfield.
Storm with the obvious stuff up and not a great game again. Our LB and RB spot are an issue at the moment I think.
Izzo in for Bray has me stumped. Izzo should have done better for the second goal and was gernally poor all night with distribution and he always looks nervy. Bray showed in one game last week he commands his box, is confident, bosses his back 4 and has good distrubution. He should have started.
Stella was as I thought he would be. Just not up to it as a starter. Starting Fletcher after he hasn't played in a century baffles me. We looked much better when Bingham came on.
Monty with the unfortunate brain snap. The poor guy has been carrying the team all season and it's probably been one of the toughest seasons of his career. It was a shame because it cost us in the end.
Fab, Posco, Austin were good I thought.
Garcia.....class is permanent. If he can start and play 60 minutes for 6 or 7 games and we work out how to cover him when we lose the ball we won't get the spoon because he will create.
I haven't been overly critical of Walmsley yet because I think he has a really tough job that nobody else would willingly take on but last night he buggered the lineup and it failed.
My perspective take: WSW are a gun team this season and we beat ourselves more than anything. We go again next week and I'm looking forward to getting to Brisbane in 2 weeks because Berisha can't break my heart up there any more
pjennings
Well-Known Member
I like that team - only thing is that I would start with Luis. He will run out of legs - but I'd like to see us establish a lead rather than chase. As he was waiting to come on we were under pressure and I thought we were going to be 2 - 0 down and game over before he came on. As it was he came on - we equalised and had the momentum and if Monty had stayed on we could well have gone on with it.
midfielder
Well-Known Member
The feeling in the crowd before Garcia came on was electric and when he played OMG his presence on the field was huge and as he gains fitness and can play a little longer he will be worth the cost of a ticket..
On the match just my throughs…
Drive Bys had the first half by a long way we struggled to put three passes together …
However their only goal came off a a very poor defensive error
Second half Mariners came out with more determination but still lacked any real structure that could hold the ball and control the game.
Garcia changed the game the kids lifted and maybe what could not be seen on TV was how he was constantly directing players all over the pitch he become the de-facto Capitan I can still see him directing and organising at one stage the entire back 4, and the two outside mids and in the structure he set up we got very much on top… What he brings is a incredible Football brain and the players just sucked in his advise and direction…
Monty OMG mate … just clam down he got the ball and not the player but studs up and sliding FFS what a brain snap just hope refs sent all players off for this type of tackle because I have seen many go unpunished this year.
The last goal again … a mistake by the goal keeper in clearing out the ball started it then Neil handled it well and then football about Football rule 101 and tried to do a Messie ..
Over all three general themes for me…
We went out with the wrong team hard to know how Fletcher started up front maybe nervous got to him…
On the Drive Bys … last night they kept play the fall down and get me a free … This is hand on heart stuff its been a long while since I have seen a team so often go down on the smallest of touches … it was not one player it seemed to me to be the entire midfield and a couple of backs .. I am hoping this is not coming across as sour grapes … To me it seemed to be a tacit and very very annoying ….
On balance the Drive Bys were better on the night … however Garcia will be of massive value and his leadership on the field will be massive
On the match just my throughs…
Drive Bys had the first half by a long way we struggled to put three passes together …
However their only goal came off a a very poor defensive error
Second half Mariners came out with more determination but still lacked any real structure that could hold the ball and control the game.
Garcia changed the game the kids lifted and maybe what could not be seen on TV was how he was constantly directing players all over the pitch he become the de-facto Capitan I can still see him directing and organising at one stage the entire back 4, and the two outside mids and in the structure he set up we got very much on top… What he brings is a incredible Football brain and the players just sucked in his advise and direction…
Monty OMG mate … just clam down he got the ball and not the player but studs up and sliding FFS what a brain snap just hope refs sent all players off for this type of tackle because I have seen many go unpunished this year.
The last goal again … a mistake by the goal keeper in clearing out the ball started it then Neil handled it well and then football about Football rule 101 and tried to do a Messie ..
Over all three general themes for me…
We went out with the wrong team hard to know how Fletcher started up front maybe nervous got to him…
On the Drive Bys … last night they kept play the fall down and get me a free … This is hand on heart stuff its been a long while since I have seen a team so often go down on the smallest of touches … it was not one player it seemed to me to be the entire midfield and a couple of backs .. I am hoping this is not coming across as sour grapes … To me it seemed to be a tacit and very very annoying ….
On balance the Drive Bys were better on the night … however Garcia will be of massive value and his leadership on the field will be massive
pjennings
Well-Known Member
The other thing is while many people were saying WSW came out well and dominated in the first half my view is that like last week we looked jaded in the first week. It must be said that it has been incredibly humid for the last 2 weeks and not be nasty to BJ but the way the body responds to training loads is where Clark excelled.
We gave away 2 halves of football 2 weeks in a row. We are last - we cannot afford to do that unless we want to remain there
We gave away 2 halves of football 2 weeks in a row. We are last - we cannot afford to do that unless we want to remain there
Luca Brasi
Well-Known Member
There were about 80 people at the pre match function, TW explained his selections along these lines
- Izzo is our #1 keeper and an Olyroo player, he starts given his return from international duty/injury. Bray is close, good to have competition for the spot.
- Josh Rose has been struggling in recent weeks, thought that the physical match up with Castellan would be better served by a fit and confident Neill at LB.
- Liam Rose is ''pound for pound the best player at the club'' (not sure how he defines this, technically/potential??) at just 18, he needs to be playing.
- Stella is the attacking midfielder but is short on match time, liked what they have seen of him on the pitch so far.
- Fletcher has a great pedigree, good professional, imposing physique and faster than he seems, has been training well and want him to start.
My observations of the match were
- agree with the sentiments about Izzo, slow to decide what to do, poor distribution, fails to provide an option for defenders and does not command the box.
- Josh Rose has been struggling but so has Roux. With Monty out next week I think he needs to come back in to provide some experience/leadership. Not convinced that McDonald is a better option.
- I think Liam Rose goes ok but there is something wrong with our midfield structure, he and Monty were playing way to close to each other, Stella didnt fit in the best but it was attempt to have a ball player on the pitch and hold some possession. The whole structure improved as soon as LG came on. LG = vision, composure, class.
- Fletcher would have looked better if he received some service to his feet in the 1st half, if we are going to play on the counter attack then I think Bingham is more mobile and fitter for the job atm.
- You know what you are getting with Austin, his pace causes all defenders problems but his passing/crossing is inconsistent. He is now getting back much more, laid on some seriously good tackles in the first 10 mins.
Hutch was saying we are 6 months into an 18 month project so there is still some work to do, but for two awful defensive errors it could have been a different night.
- Izzo is our #1 keeper and an Olyroo player, he starts given his return from international duty/injury. Bray is close, good to have competition for the spot.
- Josh Rose has been struggling in recent weeks, thought that the physical match up with Castellan would be better served by a fit and confident Neill at LB.
- Liam Rose is ''pound for pound the best player at the club'' (not sure how he defines this, technically/potential??) at just 18, he needs to be playing.
- Stella is the attacking midfielder but is short on match time, liked what they have seen of him on the pitch so far.
- Fletcher has a great pedigree, good professional, imposing physique and faster than he seems, has been training well and want him to start.
My observations of the match were
- agree with the sentiments about Izzo, slow to decide what to do, poor distribution, fails to provide an option for defenders and does not command the box.
- Josh Rose has been struggling but so has Roux. With Monty out next week I think he needs to come back in to provide some experience/leadership. Not convinced that McDonald is a better option.
- I think Liam Rose goes ok but there is something wrong with our midfield structure, he and Monty were playing way to close to each other, Stella didnt fit in the best but it was attempt to have a ball player on the pitch and hold some possession. The whole structure improved as soon as LG came on. LG = vision, composure, class.
- Fletcher would have looked better if he received some service to his feet in the 1st half, if we are going to play on the counter attack then I think Bingham is more mobile and fitter for the job atm.
- You know what you are getting with Austin, his pace causes all defenders problems but his passing/crossing is inconsistent. He is now getting back much more, laid on some seriously good tackles in the first 10 mins.
Hutch was saying we are 6 months into an 18 month project so there is still some work to do, but for two awful defensive errors it could have been a different night.
midfielder
Well-Known Member
Just an observation .... this is not in any way anti Monty as IMO he gives blood every week ...
I saw last night something I have not seen in a while in our side ... Garcia was constantly organising players around him as I mentioned earlier at one stage he organised the back 4 and wide mids twas when we had a free maybe 15 meters from there box ... he was calling all the backs and pointing to move up and where to go and pushing others mids into positions to support the play and then he moved ...
Monty plays with a huge heart but does little organising of the team... Garcia has shown the importance of having someone on the field like Dutchie and Ryan did in constantly organising players ..... Not to sure of the answer as I don't think Garcia will ever be able to play for more than an hour ... but his organising off the ball showed me to some extent what we have missed since Dutchie and Ryan left...
I saw last night something I have not seen in a while in our side ... Garcia was constantly organising players around him as I mentioned earlier at one stage he organised the back 4 and wide mids twas when we had a free maybe 15 meters from there box ... he was calling all the backs and pointing to move up and where to go and pushing others mids into positions to support the play and then he moved ...
Monty plays with a huge heart but does little organising of the team... Garcia has shown the importance of having someone on the field like Dutchie and Ryan did in constantly organising players ..... Not to sure of the answer as I don't think Garcia will ever be able to play for more than an hour ... but his organising off the ball showed me to some extent what we have missed since Dutchie and Ryan left...
elevated position
Well-Known Member
Today I hate this game but I hope that the players watch the replay and watch how LG positions his body in traffic he lays on defenders using their body as a pivot point and reducing the chances of being hacked as well as taking that player out of action. Smooth.
Did you see the spray he gave Neil after the second goal, lesson 101 when a defender is under that much pressure belt the ball away as far as possible for time to set the defence for the throw.
.
Did you see the spray he gave Neil after the second goal, lesson 101 when a defender is under that much pressure belt the ball away as far as possible for time to set the defence for the throw.
.
My take is much the same from Kendell
When announced Izzo TW had no confidence. Um what's my excuse. I was close to booing but thought pull your head in. He was feeling the they don't want to hear Izzo's name how can I convince them. Yeah is an Olyroo that sounds good.
As for Rose made a lot of sense and TW sounded a lot more confident in his delivery, he believed a lot more in this decision. He has been very poor with the ball. I'm with you Luke. It wasn't so much as Neill is better just Rose has to go and Neill is the only option. Barborousous carved him up and the feeling was Castellen would do the same.. Important thing is he said while his form is poor IT WASNT for a lack of effort. Nothing to do with recent player issues.
Fletcher was also a gamble on the surprise factor, "they know nothing about him". Yeah they were surprised on why we bothered. Looked heavy to me and touch was poor as was his timing. Showed nothing they must have seen in training.
I think the thought process was stay in the game until 60m then unleash Garcia and Bingham and come home strong. Fab scores he's a genius. Monty Red and Stupid error he's a fool. To be a coach
The major thing was there where problems which went deeper than we thought. I took it that to be we thought we got it sorted when we got rid of Reddy and Bosnar but it had infiltrated through to the shooting practice 5. That was my interpretation.
Charlesworth was very clear he feels Gallop and DeBruhn want us out for South Sydney. I hope his misses doesn't get relayed his sign off joke because he will need somewhere else to sleep. I know it was to a football audience but plenty of woman there and was more can't believe you said that than funny.
WSW were well prepared for us, they know we go down the lines and ignore the middle of the field. They used the sidelines as an extra defender. In first half they had Fab, Stella and Roux pinned.
We had 2 to 3 players at max in the region on the ball all tight on the line. They had a marker on each and a second bloke cutting off the middle. From the possession holder they had at least 5 if not 6 out of 8 of the nearest players in the region. No room to move and If we went back which is what they wanted bridge was coming fast as well.
Was great pressure, we couldn't get the ball to the middle to open them up. Well coached and we are very predictable.
This is where we are miles behind the best.
We had 2 to 3 players at max in the region on the ball all tight on the line. They had a marker on each and a second bloke cutting off the middle. From the possession holder they had at least 5 if not 6 out of 8 of the nearest players in the region. No room to move and If we went back which is what they wanted bridge was coming fast as well.
Was great pressure, we couldn't get the ball to the middle to open them up. Well coached and we are very predictable.
This is where we are miles behind the best.
As for crowd looked like plenty missing on the east. The navy was supposed to be sold out but heaps of room.
I'd say the crowd figure would be pretty accurate, looked like some room on the end as well.
Got to give it to WSW they travel really well, but what would the crowd have been without them? Not to sure we got the crowd bump Garcia deserved from locals. Hopefully they were waiting to see how he went.
I'd say the crowd figure would be pretty accurate, looked like some room on the end as well.
Got to give it to WSW they travel really well, but what would the crowd have been without them? Not to sure we got the crowd bump Garcia deserved from locals. Hopefully they were waiting to see how he went.
Stella is not bad IMO. He makes good runs and is positions Caceras wasn't. Doesn't have the ball control Caceras had but no one does, but does plenty of other things.
Think his selection is how we want to play and we're supposed to but had to forget it when we dumped Caceras. Also the Garcia for Stella and Bingham for Fletcher were premeditated.
Think his selection is how we want to play and we're supposed to but had to forget it when we dumped Caceras. Also the Garcia for Stella and Bingham for Fletcher were premeditated.
Monty got in a tangle with Bridge a few times and was getting under their skin. Also got in a little scrap just before the send off near their attacking box with two or three kicking him and him kicking everything in sight. Got Castellens ankle.
He was fired up and was taking it to them and the crowd was roaring. Just bad timing with a blood rush. Unfortunately ended up costing us the game but who really cares.
Posco, Neill, Austin and Neill were quite aggressive which was great. Usually WSW bully us. The WSW fans are spewing about it on their forum ( had a look to see their reaction),
He was fired up and was taking it to them and the crowd was roaring. Just bad timing with a blood rush. Unfortunately ended up costing us the game but who really cares.
Posco, Neill, Austin and Neill were quite aggressive which was great. Usually WSW bully us. The WSW fans are spewing about it on their forum ( had a look to see their reaction),
Join me, you know you want to
Is BG missing as well?Gosh I miss Roy's analysis.
I hope he is ok?
Well WSW closed him well, being a player short didn't help and Bingham is not used to being on the left wing and was Neills outlet as Garcia was now striker/middle of field.
However he would have been better just turning it over trying to hit Bingham, but how much was the Victory debacle on his mind when they probably got canned for just pumping it anywhere.
Sometimes young players don't know when to listen and when not to listen. Shouldn't need the coach to say we don't play like that again UNLESS we down to 10 men's with 5 to go, then punt it as much as possible.
Not sure Izzo deserves any heat for the goal and maybe Roux who was 5 metres behind Santa but where was coming back from I don't know
Not sure Monty has the time to do this on the field but interesting what you picked up.
At pre game Hutch mentioned he was riding the boys, so already showing he is a great signing just for them little own us
Gratis
Well-Known Member
The errors early on weren't good. That said the only goal going into the break came from our team passing straight to bridge in our box - it was more or less an own goal.
I don't have an opinion on Fletcher yet. We were too well pressed for him to have had a chance. Regardless Bingham deserved to start on form and confirmed it for me the second he came on. Should start next week. Happy with Austin and Fab. Won't go on there. Stella again didn't do much but for the same reasons as Fletcher. I'd continue starting him for Garcia and bring Garcia on earlier and earlier every game.
To the back half of the field...
Monty, not his best but better than most and I'll give him this one considering he has played like 3 players every week all season.
Neill was an interesting one. I was in a good position to watch him closely for the first half. Castellan should, could and nearly did skin him. No slight, castellan is fast and talented. But he didn't. Mickey worked extremely hard under a lot of pressure to contain him and basically did, even when it seemed he had no right to. I'm not surprised that by the 86th minute playing with 10 men he misjudged - he was mentally and physically fatigued by that point.
Ascroft made some key saves in that first half and showed some real class at times, they seem to have gone unnoticed by pay attention if you watch a replay. Didn't keep a real eye on him all game but was very pleased with some of his work early on. Posco solid - easily one of our best defenders and consistently. Good for him and us. Roux...definitely not his best, I won't go on there either we all saw it.
Izzo. Better game from him. BRAY SHOULD START. Izzo is my 3rd choice of our three keepers too. He CAN stop a ball but his positioning, decision making and timing fill me with dread every time the ball is on its way towards him. I can only imagine our defenders feel the same way. We know what sort of effect this has. Bray has earnt the spot so far.
So we weren't real good until Garcia came on. Then we were. As has been pointed out he somehow directed everyone, well, and didn't miss his cue to play as well. I was looking forward to the Austin-Garcia-Fab show and was quickly rewarded. As has been said bring him on before the others are tired and don't look away. Bingham in front of that trio for me please, Fletcher for sub till he shows the fitness and form take Bingham's spot. Garcia was a joy to watch with or without the ball. It was a pleasure.
So Garcia came on and we came good. Fab misses a 2nd by a goalpost - had it gone in it's a different game. Even then we still looked like taking it but the red card changed everything and we were gormless again until eventually wsw just ran over us. It required a mistake to actually score a second though.
It must be noted that it took two mistakes for their two goals. They are the league leaders but without our poor errors they didn't produce a goal.
Oh - and ffs - vidosic and to a vaguely lesser extent castellan going down and crying like bitches for an ambulance every five friggin minutes. The team vet should have put them down after the fifth broken leg they got between them. But low and behold! Back on the field plying like nothing had happened seconds later! Surprised they didn't get stretchered off to be straight back on. My respect for players like that plummets.
We need some points to get off the spoon, but with some sensible team selections, Garcia's direction and influence and some games against some of the lower ladder teams (pert, newc and welly) I think we still can get the points we need. For the points equation it'll be interesting to see if we get a wounded flapping brisbane team or a resurgent bouncing back Alan partridge style brisbane
I don't have an opinion on Fletcher yet. We were too well pressed for him to have had a chance. Regardless Bingham deserved to start on form and confirmed it for me the second he came on. Should start next week. Happy with Austin and Fab. Won't go on there. Stella again didn't do much but for the same reasons as Fletcher. I'd continue starting him for Garcia and bring Garcia on earlier and earlier every game.
To the back half of the field...
Monty, not his best but better than most and I'll give him this one considering he has played like 3 players every week all season.
Neill was an interesting one. I was in a good position to watch him closely for the first half. Castellan should, could and nearly did skin him. No slight, castellan is fast and talented. But he didn't. Mickey worked extremely hard under a lot of pressure to contain him and basically did, even when it seemed he had no right to. I'm not surprised that by the 86th minute playing with 10 men he misjudged - he was mentally and physically fatigued by that point.
Ascroft made some key saves in that first half and showed some real class at times, they seem to have gone unnoticed by pay attention if you watch a replay. Didn't keep a real eye on him all game but was very pleased with some of his work early on. Posco solid - easily one of our best defenders and consistently. Good for him and us. Roux...definitely not his best, I won't go on there either we all saw it.
Izzo. Better game from him. BRAY SHOULD START. Izzo is my 3rd choice of our three keepers too. He CAN stop a ball but his positioning, decision making and timing fill me with dread every time the ball is on its way towards him. I can only imagine our defenders feel the same way. We know what sort of effect this has. Bray has earnt the spot so far.
So we weren't real good until Garcia came on. Then we were. As has been pointed out he somehow directed everyone, well, and didn't miss his cue to play as well. I was looking forward to the Austin-Garcia-Fab show and was quickly rewarded. As has been said bring him on before the others are tired and don't look away. Bingham in front of that trio for me please, Fletcher for sub till he shows the fitness and form take Bingham's spot. Garcia was a joy to watch with or without the ball. It was a pleasure.
So Garcia came on and we came good. Fab misses a 2nd by a goalpost - had it gone in it's a different game. Even then we still looked like taking it but the red card changed everything and we were gormless again until eventually wsw just ran over us. It required a mistake to actually score a second though.
It must be noted that it took two mistakes for their two goals. They are the league leaders but without our poor errors they didn't produce a goal.
Oh - and ffs - vidosic and to a vaguely lesser extent castellan going down and crying like bitches for an ambulance every five friggin minutes. The team vet should have put them down after the fifth broken leg they got between them. But low and behold! Back on the field plying like nothing had happened seconds later! Surprised they didn't get stretchered off to be straight back on. My respect for players like that plummets.
We need some points to get off the spoon, but with some sensible team selections, Garcia's direction and influence and some games against some of the lower ladder teams (pert, newc and welly) I think we still can get the points we need. For the points equation it'll be interesting to see if we get a wounded flapping brisbane team or a resurgent bouncing back Alan partridge style brisbane
Forum Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Lots of great posts that makes for great reading in this thread. Cheers everyone.
Middy interesting point re Monty Garcia organisation. Hadn't thought about it. But yeah, Monty plays all out like a man at arms, and we're definitely a better side for it, but as Big Al eluded to, he's easily the busiest of all our players and never stops working. In short he's always leading by example. But we clearly need a general besides a man at arms, and so that looks to be something else Garcia will give us. Have always felt CB's and Keepers make for the best organisers fro obvious reasons, but Garcia with his experience and the fact he's not being asked to work box to box should be a huge help by the look of things...
Middy interesting point re Monty Garcia organisation. Hadn't thought about it. But yeah, Monty plays all out like a man at arms, and we're definitely a better side for it, but as Big Al eluded to, he's easily the busiest of all our players and never stops working. In short he's always leading by example. But we clearly need a general besides a man at arms, and so that looks to be something else Garcia will give us. Have always felt CB's and Keepers make for the best organisers fro obvious reasons, but Garcia with his experience and the fact he's not being asked to work box to box should be a huge help by the look of things...
midfielder
Well-Known Member
FP
CB or at least one is normally the talker at the back I guess it highlights how poor we are in this area when a 10 starts doing it... however almost impossible to do from 10 when the match is in play for all players behind you.
To me this demonstrates why we kept Bonsar and had hopes for Reddy to step up but they could not buy in to the new ways...
As a player I played with many excellent organiser's and in recent years have been that person.... My personal experiences for what they are worth is teams without an organiser do not perform as well teams with a couple of good organisers...
As a coach I had similar experiences ..
CB or at least one is normally the talker at the back I guess it highlights how poor we are in this area when a 10 starts doing it... however almost impossible to do from 10 when the match is in play for all players behind you.
To me this demonstrates why we kept Bonsar and had hopes for Reddy to step up but they could not buy in to the new ways...
As a player I played with many excellent organiser's and in recent years have been that person.... My personal experiences for what they are worth is teams without an organiser do not perform as well teams with a couple of good organisers...
As a coach I had similar experiences ..
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