McKINNA OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dub]

Waited and watched for McKinna to react after each goal was scored. Not once did he get off his ar*e and shout instructions or encouragement to the team. In comparison when Ferguson was around he was rarely seen sitting down. Not good enough Lawrie time to go.

you're right - yelling and abusing someone straight after they know they made a mistake will motivate them to do better  :  :  :  :  :

The poor darlings might get upset if Lawrie shouts at them ?

???

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

He hardly ever shouted at the player at all.
+ all the best managers hardly ever yell n scream ala Fergi

Yes that is why he should have kept Boza after Ferguson left to help him with the defence who else knows better than he ,when he was talked to every week by Fergi in the dressing room of OLD TRAF about his kicking.

 

[Razorback]

Waited and watched for McKinna to react after each goal was scored. Not once did he get off his ar*e and shout instructions or encouragement to the team. In comparison when Ferguson was around he was rarely seen sitting down. Not good enough Lawrie time to go.

you're right - yelling and abusing someone straight after they know they made a mistake will motivate them to do better  :  :  :  :  :

The poor darlings might get upset if Lawrie shouts at them ?

???

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

He hardly ever shouted at the player at all.
+ all the best managers hardly ever yell n scream ala Fergi

Fergie throws boots instead

 

[Bex]

Hmmmm, okay then, my mistake. Tactics are not the issue, its all about whether Lawries shouts at players from the sideline.  :

 

[clarence]

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

OK someone has got to ask -  - - I'll do it  -- - -  -

Deej,

How are the players spending the public holidays?

I am not in a position to find a Mariners player, but you seem to already know the answer, so I'll ask you instead if that's OK?

I don't specifically blame a lot of the players for what happened against Kawasaki, a number of them did what they could against better opposition. There were some oxygen thieves and a certain forward who lost all heart when his poor nose got a belt.

I do lay some blame against Lawrie -  he should have tried to shut down Kawasaki when it was obvious we couldn't match them (like when it was 3-0 at halftime). OK, that would have meant little chance of any score for us, but at least it might have gained some dignity instead of the capitulation that happened.

However..... I lay a lot of the blame for this loss and the embarrassment it brought the club and the region, to the board and those who have kept tight reins (perhaps too tight) on the money purse. Simply put, the Mariners should have had better players on the pitch against Kawasaki and we did not have them.

 

[mariners4ever]

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

OK someone has got to ask -  - - I'll do it  -- - -  -

Deej,

How are the players spending the public holidays?

i'm guessing lawrie got them stuck into training

 

[masmariner]

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

OK someone has got to ask -  - - I'll do it  -- - -  -

Deej,

How are the players spending the public holidays?

i'm guessing lawrie got them stuck into training

Training down at Pat Morley in the mornings.

 

[Deej]

There was plenty of shouting, perhaps ask 1 of the players how they are spending their public holidays?

Lawrie being the professional he is does not abuse his players in public, 1 reason I guess why so many players respect him

OK someone has got to ask -  - - I'll do it  -- - -  -

Deej,

How are the players spending the public holidays?

I am not in a position to find a Mariners player, but you seem to already know the answer, so I'll ask you instead if that's OK?

I don't specifically blame a lot of the players for what happened against Kawasaki, a number of them did what they could against better opposition. There were some oxygen thieves and a certain forward who lost all heart when his poor nose got a belt.

I do lay some blame against Lawrie -  he should have tried to shut down Kawasaki when it was obvious we couldn't match them (like when it was 3-0 at halftime). OK, that would have meant little chance of any score for us, but at least it might have gained some dignity instead of the capitulation that happened.

However..... I lay a lot of the blame for this loss and the embarrassment it brought the club and the region, to the board and those who have kept tight reins (perhaps too tight) on the money purse. Simply put, the Mariners should have had better players on the pitch against Kawasaki and we did not have them.

For starters there was a tough training session on Friday and a double training session on Monday

 

[dibo]

There was an interesting discussion on SFCU some time ago talking about the amount of training that HAL sides do. Apparently we do more than most, but SFC had some crazily light regime along the lines of:

[quote author=Kaiser]A typical schedule consists of (and keep in mind the sessions are usually 2hrs each, give or take):

Monday 10am recovery session (that's the vision you might see of them frolicking at the beach, or wading through a cold pool)
Tuesday 10am gym session
Wednesday REST DAY
Thursday 10am Field session
Friday 10.30am Media (field) session (open to media, with interviews between 11.30am-midday)
Saturday 10am Field session
Sunday Match Day

This is for a HOME Sunday night match. You can ditch the Saturday session if there's a match on Saturday night. Ditch the Friday session if there's a Friday night match.

If the team is AWAY they are likely to ditch one of the sessions as well.[/quote]

[quote author=Kaiser]What I posted was a typical training schedule for SFC under Kosmina.

Aurelio Vidmar at Adelaide tends to do the same PLUS 1 extra afternoon session
Lawrie McKinna at the Mariners tends to do the same PLUS 2 extra afternoon sessions. Much more realistic.
Ernie Merrick at Melbourne - I can't find that info
Gary van Egmond at Newcastle - tends to have 2 days off, but also have 2 days with both morning and afternoon sessions (ends up similar workload to Kossie/SFC)
David Mitchell at Perth - similar to SFC/Kossie, but maybe with 1 or 2 afternoon sessions depending on Perth's heavy travel schedule.
Farina at Qld - similar again. Generally has 1 morning session every day of the week except for one rest day. Another day off if it's match day or travel day. Home games he would have 1 morning session 5 days of the week, plus a rest day and match day. Similar to SFC.
Herbert at Wellington - I can't find that info

So it matches up quite closely, although it's probably a session shy of the average.[/quote]

I've always kinda had the feeling that teams would be training at a minimum a couple of hours a day, and that in addition to team training individual players would work on things themselves.

Players who hit dead balls a lot you might expect to find spending at least a few hours each week just practicing and finessing, because every hour you put in pays off. Att: Mariners corner takers...

I'd be very curious (especially given Wednesday night) as to the comparison between typical Australian training regimes and Japanese (or Chinese or Korean) regimes.

But while I can't find it at the moment, I have heard that HAL coaches tend to actually discourage players from doing work by themselves for fear of injuries! Crazy!

 

[Teddy Bear]

Waited and watched for McKinna to react after each goal was scored. Not once did he get off his ar*e and shout instructions or encouragement to the team. In comparison when Ferguson was around he was rarely seen sitting down. Not good enough Lawrie time to go.

you're right - yelling and abusing someone straight after they know they made a mistake will motivate them to do better  :  :  :  :  :

Where did I mention he should yell and abuse the team? Probably best to read the comments first before hitting reply.  :  :  :  :  :  :  :  :  :

Not too often you see a manager and coach sit all game with arms folded when the team is in a hole getting bigger as the game went on.

 

[scottmac]

Waited and watched for McKinna to react after each goal was scored. Not once did he get off his ar*e and shout instructions or encouragement to the team. In comparison when Ferguson was around he was rarely seen sitting down. Not good enough Lawrie time to go.

you're right - yelling and abusing someone straight after they know they made a mistake will motivate them to do better  :  :  :  :  :

Where did I mention he should yell and abuse the team? Probably best to read the comments first before hitting reply.  :  :  :  :  :  :  :  :  :

Not too often you see a manager and coach sit all game with arms folded when the team is in a hole getting bigger as the game went on.

+1

Rarely have i seen Mckinna react to a situation with any type of decision. He tends to just sit there untill its too late and then make a decision to change shape or players. IMO he looks scared. To sit on your hands an entire match is not good.

Then again we also have a captian that you rarely see barking intsructions or displaying any type of leadership.

 

[David Votoupal]

The Mariners have sorely lacked the following things:
1) a defensive organiser in the mould of a Muscat or Costanzo
2) a genuine match-turning player (a problem from the very start)
3) a big character in the dressing room who can lift and inspire the players

This is where the club's conservative, risk-averse recruitment policy is really coming apart. It needs to change in order to stay in touch in an ever more competitive league.

 

[FFC Mariner]

The Mariners have sorely lacked the following things:
1) a defensive organiser in the mould of a Musc**t or Costanzo LM admitted that we needed an "enforcer" after S3
2) a genuine match-turning player (a problem from the very start)Tommy you mean?
3) a big character in the dressing room who can lift and inspire the playersSee point 1

This is where the club's conservative, risk-averse recruitment policy is really coming apart. It needs to change in order to stay in touch in an ever more competitive league.

 

[Jesus]

There was an interesting discussion on SFCU some time ago talking about the amount of training that HAL sides do. Apparently we do more than most, but SFC had some crazily light regime along the lines of:

[quote author=Kaiser]A typical schedule consists of (and keep in mind the sessions are usually 2hrs each, give or take):

Monday 10am recovery session (that's the vision you might see of them frolicking at the beach, or wading through a cold pool)
Tuesday 10am gym session
Wednesday REST DAY
Thursday 10am Field session
Friday 10.30am Media (field) session (open to media, with interviews between 11.30am-midday)
Saturday 10am Field session
Sunday Match Day

This is for a HOME Sunday night match. You can ditch the Saturday session if there's a match on Saturday night. Ditch the Friday session if there's a Friday night match.

If the team is AWAY they are likely to ditch one of the sessions as well.

[quote author=Kaiser]What I posted was a typical training schedule for SFC under Kosmina.

Aurelio Vidmar at Adelaide tends to do the same PLUS 1 extra afternoon session
Lawrie McKinna at the Mariners tends to do the same PLUS 2 extra afternoon sessions. Much more realistic.
Ernie Merrick at Melbourne - I can't find that info
Gary van Egmond at Newcastle - tends to have 2 days off, but also have 2 days with both morning and afternoon sessions (ends up similar workload to Kossie/SFC)
David Mitchell at Perth - similar to SFC/Kossie, but maybe with 1 or 2 afternoon sessions depending on Perth's heavy travel schedule.
Farina at Qld - similar again. Generally has 1 morning session every day of the week except for one rest day. Another day off if it's match day or travel day. Home games he would have 1 morning session 5 days of the week, plus a rest day and match day. Similar to SFC.
Herbert at Wellington - I can't find that info

So it matches up quite closely, although it's probably a session shy of the average.[/quote]

I've always kinda had the feeling that teams would be training at a minimum a couple of hours a day, and that in addition to team training individual players would work on things themselves.

Players who hit dead balls a lot you might expect to find spending at least a few hours each week just practicing and finessing, because every hour you put in pays off. Att: Mariners corner takers...

I'd be very curious (especially given Wednesday night) as to the comparison between typical Australian training regimes and Japanese (or Chinese or Korean) regimes.

But while I can't find it at the moment, I have heard that HAL coaches tend to actually discourage players from doing work by themselves for fear of injuries! Crazy!
[/quote]

And here i sort of assumed that there would basically be 2 sessions a day morning and afternoon, but maybe with a rest day.

 

[midfielder]

Throughout Hal 4 we leaked goals... we lost Viddy at the end of Hal 3 the organiser of the defense in Hal 2 & 3. My guess is the management knew Viddy was going half way through Hal 3.

With all the players trailing I have heard of mids & strikers... the goals conceded from set plays in our box over the last 2 seasons and last year in particular does not read well...

I do wonder aloud if we are going to change our back four and defensive tactics in the box. But we need someone to organise the backs and be clam on the ball. This is LM test fix up our back four if not I suggest he will not make it to the second round of Hal 5.. This problem is approaching 16 months and by the second round of Hal 5 will be near on 20 months assuming its not fixed ... but lets all hope it is fixed...

 

[striker]

Midfielder, you are right ... our defence is shit.  you will probably agree that we need to look O/S for a couple of defenders.  We could do with a few fast midfielders too.... and a decent striker.

what's this club got against bringing players from other parts of the world?

 

[clarence]

Midfielder, you are right ... our defence is shit.  you will probably agree that we need to look O/S for a couple of defenders.  We could do with a few fast midfielders too.... and a decent striker.

what's this club got against bringing players from other parts of the world?

I simply think they believe that it's better to actually eye ball the players & trail them before getting into negotiations. And I'd doubt they'd have the resources to send off Lawrie or Tobin every second week to scout OS.

I do sense they want to get the player on the rise rather than on the downside of their career too (like Jedinak was with us -  on the rise, that is).

Also, in the first couple of seasons, Lawrie was capable of scouting players for himself from the State League. I doubt he now has the time to do this efficiently, and has probably let a few contacts slip over the last couple of seasons, and lost touch with who are the players to watch.

His challenge now, is to either develop players from their NYL ranks (and if you saw the NYL last season you can appreciate that would be harder than you expect, lol!), and/or pickup the occassional recommended player from OS. But he will have to start trusting other people's opinions and might be hard for Lawrie to accept, as he has been so independent for so long.

 

[striker]

............ But he will have to start trusting other people's opinions and might be hard for Lawrie to accept, as he has been so independent for so long.

A good manager has to delegate...... one can not do everything himself.....

 

[midfielder]

Midfielder, you are right ... our defence is shit.  you will probably agree that we need to look O/S for a couple of defenders.  We could do with a few fast midfielders too.... and a decent striker.

what's this club got against bringing players from other parts of the world?

I simply think they believe that it's better to actually eye ball the players & trail them before getting into negotiations. And I'd doubt they'd have the resources to send off Lawrie or Tobin every second week to scout OS.

I do sense they want to get the player on the rise rather than on the downside of their career too (like Jedinak was with us -  on the rise, that is).

Also, in the first couple of seasons, Lawrie was capable of scouting players for himself from the State League. I doubt he now has the time to do this efficiently, and has probably let a few contacts slip over the last couple of seasons, and lost touch with who are the players to watch.

His challenge now, is to either develop players from their NYL ranks (and if you saw the NYL last season you can appreciate that would be harder than you expect, lol!), and/or pickup the occassional recommended player from OS. But he will have to start trusting other people's opinions and might be hard for Lawrie to accept, as he has been so independent for so long.

Clarence

In Hal 4 this approach was OK but we have had 17 months of looking... that's my point.. there comes a point if you can't fix the defense up we need to find someone who can

 

[clarence]

Midfielder, you are right ... our defence is shit.  you will probably agree that we need to look O/S for a couple of defenders.  We could do with a few fast midfielders too.... and a decent striker.

what's this club got against bringing players from other parts of the world?

I simply think they believe that it's better to actually eye ball the players & trail them before getting into negotiations. And I'd doubt they'd have the resources to send off Lawrie or Tobin every second week to scout OS.

I do sense they want to get the player on the rise rather than on the downside of their career too (like Jedinak was with us -  on the rise, that is).

Also, in the first couple of seasons, Lawrie was capable of scouting players for himself from the State League. I doubt he now has the time to do this efficiently, and has probably let a few contacts slip over the last couple of seasons, and lost touch with who are the players to watch.

His challenge now, is to either develop players from their NYL ranks (and if you saw the NYL last season you can appreciate that would be harder than you expect, lol!), and/or pickup the occassional recommended player from OS. But he will have to start trusting other people's opinions and might be hard for Lawrie to accept, as he has been so independent for so long.

Clarence

In Hal 4 this approach was OK but we have had 17 months of looking... that's my point.. there comes a point if you can't fix the defense up we need to find someone who can

Midfielder, I was responding to Striker #9's comments more so than yours.

And yes, Lawrie has to start addressing the deficiencies in our defence. To think he has one of the all time Australian top defenders as his assistant coach, and he can't get his team coached properly to defend. Pretty embarrassing really. :-[

Surely Tobin has some idea about defensive tactics, if Lawrie can't figure it out. Mind you, our defence snapped to attention when Bosnich was in goals, so maybe Danny isn't directing traffic with as much authority as Bosnich did.

 

[midfielder]

Clarence

It's poor that is for sure especially when you consider Tobin, who I still rate in my first Soccrroo 11, is there.

Hind sight is great but Meggys in Hal 1, and Viddy in Hal 2 & 3 organised the defense... Bozza was good I agree but he played in a couple of pre season games as well... however it does show Danny in a poor light by comparison ... Again but Bozza in his time is regarded at his best as one of the top three keepers of his time thus being a hard act to follow.

Wilko struggles and is the captain ... but whether its calling, marking, or whatever we do get ourselves into some horrible mess at the back at times and if has to be fixed .. most teams seem stronger going into Hal 5. I do wonder where our new defensive structure is coming from... maybe it's the kids to save us maybe Porter is a midfielder playing at the back ... this is the call of the coach and his staff ...all I know is most teams are getting better at attack and our defense is a shambles and unless we fix it we are in for a rough season ...

A I said earlier if not fixed by round 1, in spite of everything  LM brings the club a new coach will be found IMO.