Marcos Flores gets it

[ccf]

Sorry nebakke didn't mean to put down the whole team but only thinking of the games I have been to and seen Marcos surrounded by fans.....haven't seen Kwas so can't comment on him

 

[midfielder]

Watched an SBS vid with Bernie, he said SFC made an offer to his club and as Mosey said yesterday we never got a chance to counter bid ... and weeMac was taken by Arnie...

Storm & Kalik may light the season up next year ...

Looking at our gains and losses in the midfield ... gains ... Kim, Trifiro & Sim ... losses weeMac, Bernie, Marcos .

Mosey could be in for a difficult year … Arnold and a great bunch of juniors gave us a head start on most teams... however WSW, Roar, SFC, AU, Heart today have excellent coaches ... further Jest, Nix have decent academies ... only PG seem [and he may turn out OK in his second season] to not have a high quality coach...

If you move Kim to the wing as Bernie’s replacement, does it open up a spot … TBH I don’t know …

Just glad I am not the coach..

 

[localpom]

Watched an SBS vid with Bernie, he said SFC made an offer to his club and as Mosey said yesterday we never got a chance to counter bid ... and weeMac was taken by Arnie...

Storm & Kalik may light the season up next year ...

Looking at our gains and losses in the midfield ... gains ... Kim, Trifiro & Sim ... losses weeMac, Bernie, Marcos .

Mosey could be in for a difficult year … Arnold and a great bunch of juniors gave us a head start on most teams... however WSW, Roar, SFC, AU, Heart today have excellent coaches ... further Jest, Nix have decent academies ... only PG seem [and he may turn out OK in his second season] to not have a high quality coach...

If you move Kim to the wing as Bernie’s replacement, does it open up a spot … TBH I don’t know …

Just glad I am not the coach..

Good thing about the gains and losses in our midfield is that none of our losses figured last season for more than a couple of months. So....we won't lose a great deal from last year anyway.The 3 newbies (injuries apart) will be constants all season. Kim will be as good as any of those three we have lost and I have a suspicion Trifiro will surprise alot of people. Sim is a good back up utility player.

 

[Big Al]

For the price should definately have been resigned. Kim is multi purpose would have covered Berni (which to be fair Mossy prob didn't see coming).

& Trifiro is solid but hasn't lit up the league yet & Kalik has promise but is young & raw.

Bad mistake by Mossy - Surely had to be more to it than a spot on the roster because it wasn't price. You have 20 something roster spots & only 15-16 on the sheet each week. I wouldn't have complained if Flores never even played next year but at least he would have been available.

Big mistake IMO

 

[Golly]

flores was willing to play for minimum wage at ccm

why didnt we sign him to that????

 

[scottmac]

I didn't like our play with Flores in the team. He played well but WE didn't. Moss made the right call IMO.

 

[eenfish]

flores was willing to play for minimum wage at ccm

why didnt we sign him to that????

Well, if he signed for min wage and did really well, he'd (rightly) demand a pay increase and we'd be having to search for a new player end of next season. If he performs average/anonymously, then it is a wasted roster spot that could be taken up by better quality player.

 

[nebakke]

I didn't like our play with Flores in the team. He played well but WE didn't. Moss made the right call IMO.

Ultimately.... THIS! So very much... I'm not sure that I'd have been calling for him to get culled if he'd played a whole season tbh, but at the end of the day, I have to say that my feelings are much the same on this subject.

 

[Jaundice]

Well, if he signed for min wage and did really well, he'd (rightly) demand a pay increase and we'd be having to search for a new player end of next season. If he performs average/anonymously, then it is a wasted roster spot that could be taken up by better quality player.

So if Trifiro sets the A league alight (god willing) next season we can expect him to stay on low pay?

Essentially what youre saying is that we should hope for our signings to stay average or we are Firetrucked. This is not why the Mariners have been succesful, our high player turnover reflects this. Its even helped our back pocket immensely with our more savvy contracts.

Im not buying the invaluable roster spots either. Kwas, Cernak and Slater? really?

 

[eenfish]

I'm just talking about the specific example of Marcos, trying to understand the reasoning behind not signing him. Personally, I'd rather Marcos than Trifiro or Cernak, but they're both contracted past this season so it is a bit of a mute point I guess.

 

[nebakke]

All this hate for Slater, has anyone actually seen him play? (obviously I don't watch the youth team )
Poor guy seems to cop a hammering because of who his father is...

 

[Big Al]

flores was willing to play for minimum wage at ccm

why didnt we sign him to that????

You could even argue under the CCM strategy his price was more important than the player.

 

[Big Al]

Well, if he signed for min wage and did really well, he'd (rightly) demand a pay increase and we'd be having to search for a new player end of next season. If he performs average/anonymously, then it is a wasted roster spot that could be taken up by better quality player.

But we would have had him for that year playing well.

 

[Big Al]

All this hate for Slater, has anyone actually seen him play? (obviously I don't watch the youth team )
Poor guy seems to cop a hammering because of who his father is...

Think you will find out this year if he is any good.

Chance for him to step up - With Berni gone & Wee Mac not back yet there is a winger spot open. Sim might be in front of him but might be time to see if has any potential otherwise we can always sell him to SFC.

 

[Roy Law]

All this hate for Slater, has anyone actually seen him play? (obviously I don't watch the youth team )
Poor guy seems to cop a hammering because of who his father is...

If he is anywhere near as good as his Dad I will be well happy!

 

[sydmariner]

mee too

 

[bikinigirl]

Really bummed I couldnt make this as had to work late. Did anyone go and if so how was it?

Sorry it has taken so long to respond … but I attended the evening with Marcos a couple of weeks ago along with … I dunno, maybe a couple of hundred people. That in itself says a lot and reflects the opinion that I already held – we really couldn’t afford to lose him.

I was saddened when it was announced that we wouldn’t be re-signing him and initially I thought that Mossy had his hands tied by the toe-cutters unwilling to meet his pay demands. But as more information (truthful or not) comes to light it does further some interesting discussion points.

Obviously Marcos gets it … and it is clear he has genuine pulling power amongst the community. He spent a couple of hours talking about his life in football, what it means to him and the influences and passion that drove him through his childhood and into a professional career.

Most of the talk was about his childhood and formative years – this is what now inspires him to offer something back, share his life and his desire to share this passion with others. To do this amongst a community that he has only been a part of for a short period and after he has already been released by the Club says a lot about the guy and what does motivate him. How many past or present players and/or staff would do that?

To me this guy is was a true marquee for the Mariners … and it is not necessarily his footballing abilities that draws people in. The only other that can be considered on the same plane in terms of engagement is Lawrie … and it says a lot that your Captain leading into his 10 year milestone with the Club has very little public draw.

I am not having a go at Hutch, they are clearly different people in many ways (and yes I acknowledge that Hutch appears great with kids one-on-one) … but it is a little depressing all the same, that we could have gained so much from keeping Marcos around.

If the discussions around his willingness to stay for a low salary are true … it would have been worthwhile from a marketing point of view alone. Because let’s face it, it is not something the Mariners do all that well … and it is not as if it would be the first time a squad position was taken up by someone with potential and/or injury concerns.

 

[bikinigirl]

Back to the contract ‘negotiations’. My understanding is that it is the business of football that brought things unstuck … and ‘nothing personal’ is the problem. I have heard a number of theories which also put things in a different light, some of which I will pose as a hypothetical:

• Flores’ agent approaches the Club demanding his client be re-signed in a short timeframe with an inferred expectation that similar terms be agreed over a longer timeframe
• The Club in the midst of a hectic period and before knowing how a recovery was going so early in the process may have questioned the motivations of such time demands
• The Club is not in a financial position to offer a significant/commensurate package
• The Club has just signed a new foreign player they have high hopes for and have a local player they hope will continue to develop, exerting pressure for a position but demanding a much lower wage
• A decision is made and all concerned parties informed
• It is later understood that money was not a key motivator for the player and that there was no real rush … perhaps a missed opportunity for all parties

OK so the arguments that he was ineffective on the pitch have merit, but the reasons for that are more than worthy of consideration:

• Who knows what happened in China … by most reports it is not the easiest place to work as a foreign football professional
• Most have agreed he was played out of position in Melbourne
• He performs best when happy and that was not the case in China or Melbourne
• Early in the campaign we suffered from a lack of cohesion and confidence which kept us pinned deep in our own half
• This flowed on to a ‘pass to Marcos or Mikey and my job is done’ mentality
• We imposed a greater defensive role on him than he has probably ever experienced before which consumed his energy and dulled his effectiveness
• He was injured before he could gain the necessary fitness to do the role that was expected of him
• The promising combinations I saw were with Duke (who was lost and out of position) and Mikey (who was in and out through NT duty, illness and ultimately a crazy loan deal) … so nothing had time to develop
• The remainder of the team was under-performing when Marcos played as well – the keeper was featuring highly in MoM voting well before Reddy came into the team
• No player provides 90+ minutes of brilliance every week

As ineffective as he may have been (in light of people’s expectations) have any of his ‘replacements’ been any more effective? Mikey, McBreen, Sterj, Kim, Trifiro, Cernak … none have set the world on fire. Fitzy and Caceres have done alright but not necessarily as No. 10. Geez listing those names out shows why we have lacked consistency and understanding in attack.

Things are rarely simple … and in many respects this was Mossy’s first big decision. It was also imposed on him at a time that he was under enormous pressure. If that was the plan from the Flores camp then it failed miserably. Hopefully it proves to be a good one from the Mariners point of view.

 

[dibo]

Time's not up for our recruitment - it is *possible* (even if it's not likely) that we sign him for season 10. If he's asked for a quick deal, I can see why the club would say no but it seems it's not on bad terms, more letting him know so he's not being strung along. Maybe he can convince the club of his worth in coming months?

 

[midfielder]

BG

Are you saying we are still a chance to sign him ... given Phil said we have enough mids, before Judas took Berine I guess...

Just on Judas, Popa and most other clubs ... Marcos's name has not even come up as a rumour ...