Whats The Score? - Ask the CCF thread

[FFC Mariner]

Everybody says that about Dibo

(sorry couldnt resist)

 

[dibo]

People who think the CCF website is great/ok/dont have a problem with, are in the minority on this thread!! I think we should go to the polls on this one!!

You made a very general claim that I refuted. The specific claim that Ted is in the minority in this thread I have no qualms with, but this doesn't tell us shit about what the majority *out there* think.

I think the website could be a lot better, CCF say they're working on it and it will live with a new setup next year. Where's the controversy.

Everybody says that about Dibo

(sorry couldnt resist)

Quiet you.

 

[nothappening]

CCF Web site is bad.


What its about probably is how much they paid for a professional to develop their web site which standard is very poor. The web site which does not meet the criteria set down in any decent web developers usability standards or others

This is not about who does what and how many hours they put in,  is about the revolting web site that is being presented to the public. Most of the local clubs web sites do a better job and the majority of them are done on a volunteer basis.

Someones 2 cents worth!

 

[woodchuck]

Question for Mr Chairman and possibly High performance Manager.

Target 11 program this year has invited 81 players from the U/10 age for boys. Doesn't this high number seem a little excessive ? Perhaps if all players accept will some of the $8000 for the 9 week program be put back into perhaps scholarships for struggling families?  After all give anyone with football nouse 30mins with those kids and you could easily cut the squad in half.

 

[Ted]

Those 81 players are divided into 6 teams. These teams play in a competition during the 9 week course.

 

[woodchuck]

Yeah I can read mate, plenty of that information on CCF website. That was not my question. By the way, why would you possibly need 6 teams to ultimately produce 2 squads ? Just appears to be the biggest money grab.

 

[Bladesman]

Woodchuck I have to disagree, I think the target 11 is an excellent initiative and here's why -

9 weeks (18 hours plus 6 games) coaching for $90 bargain!, throw in kit and ball even bigger value for money find me any other activity where you are using non public resources that is as good value
It gives every player who wants to the opportunity to try out, in the past the criticism has been that players who should be there miss out and the selection process is not transparent.  Target 11 offers the ability for multiple coaches to watch and coach the players over 9 weeks, it allows you to see the player over a period of time, see how they respond to coaching and also gets away from the situation that should a kid have be ill, away, just had a off day when you happened to scout them you may have got the wrong impression.
Money grab given that the funding in soccer still flows up rather than down then where the association can make money to subsidise other activities and costs (maybe provide scolarships) by offering great value for money activities then it should.  Your anger over cost should be directed towards the FFA as until money flows down the associations have to fund themselves somehow.

 

[Ted]

Yeah I can read mate, plenty of that information on CCF website. That was not my question. By the way, why would you possibly need 6 teams to ultimately produce 2 squads ? Just appears to be the biggest money grab.

Well seeing you can read you would know it 3 squads and not 2? 1 x Lightning and 2 x Thunder teams with 16 players in each = 48 from 81. That means everyone has a fair chance of being selected and as Bladesman pointed out above, for the money paid it's good value.

 

[Loki]

Woodchuck I have to disagree, I think the target 11 is an excellent initiative and here's why -

9 weeks (18 hours plus 6 games) coaching for $90 bargain!, throw in kit and ball even bigger value for money find me any other activity where you are using non public resources that is as good value
It gives every player who wants to the opportunity to try out, in the past the criticism has been that players who should be there miss out and the selection process is not transparent.  Target 11 offers the ability for multiple coaches to watch and coach the players over 9 weeks, it allows you to see the player over a period of time, see how they respond to coaching and also gets away from the situation that should a kid have be ill, away, just had a off day when you happened to scout them you may have got the wrong impression.
Money grab given that the funding in soccer still flows up rather than down then where the association can make money to subsidise other activities and costs (maybe provide scolarships) by offering great value for money activities then it should.  Your anger over cost should be directed towards the FFA as until money flows down the associations have to fund themselves somehow.

I would like to know who the coaches will be? What qualifications they have? How much do they get paid and how much does the Association end up with at the end?

 

[dibo]

I'd be very surprised with this or any other program that CCF or any association runs if it ran anything much ahead of cost-neutral, once you take into account coaches, gear, grounds (including opportunity cost - the cost of *not* hiring it out to someone else for use), lighting, staff hours dedicated to it etc.

 

[dibo]

Further to that last one - where do people think the money goes from a program that *does* run at better than revenue neutral?

It's not like it's a private business where someone gets to buy a new boat with the profits. It's a community association with a non-profit motive. The money goes straight back into football.

 

[Loki]

If CCF want to be fully transparent then the figures should be available. I am not happy to see CCF make a profit out of 10 year olds because they can. I am also not happy to see coaches getting paid over the top amounts of money. So if there are NO figures available I will make up my own mind like alot of other people as to where the money goes.

 

[dibo]

A couple of things.

If CCF is an incorporated association, copies of the financial statements will be available to members.

If CCF has a non-profit objective (and I'd walk naked up Mann St wearing a backpack full of funnel webs if they didn't) there can be no 'profit'. They might run a surplus from time to time which can be only reinvested into advancing the objectives of the Association.

If anyone thinks that somewhere in the middle of this there's someone making a bucket of money out of football they're going to be sadly mistaken. There are better, easier and less stressful ways of making a bucket of cash out of football. It's been said many times in fact that the only way to make a small fortune out of football is to start with a large fortune.

 

[Ted]

If CCF want to be fully transparent then the figures should be available. I am not happy to see CCF make a profit out of 10 year olds because they can. I am also not happy to see coaches getting paid over the top amounts of money. So if there are NO figures available I will make up my own mind like alot of other people as to where the money goes.

Under $100 outlay for a 9 week course which includes a playing strip, a ball, a competition (10 games + finals), 9 training sessions and insurance to do both all included?

 

[dibo]

Insurance will probably be covered if the player is a registered player under FNSW, but the strip and ball wouldn't give much change from $40 if at all so then you've got 9 weeks for $50. Big bickies there I tells ya!

 

[Ted]

Insurance will probably be covered if the player is a registered player under FNSW, but the strip and ball wouldn't give much change from $40 if at all so then you've got 9 weeks for $50. Big bickies there I tells ya!

yeah mate retirement funds for sure

 

[OJ]

It is amazing how people will try and undermine anything done by the CCF!!

 

[CCF Chairman]

If CCF want to be fully transparent then the figures should be available. I am not happy to see CCF make a profit out of 10 year olds because they can. I am also not happy to see coaches getting paid over the top amounts of money. So if there are NO figures available I will make up my own mind like alot of other people as to where the money goes.

CCF is fully transparent and details are available to members - if you belonged to a club you would know that. Anyone who thinks a talent identification program designed to identify players for selection in the Lightning and Thunder squads for next year is a money making exercise is delusional. It is priced to cover costs involved.

Compare the costs with other programs (none of which I have any problem with and have had my own kids involved in) that are available on the Central Coast.

FNSW - 20 sessions @ $15 plus GST = $330
Gear (2 x Nike strips, bag, ball, watter bottle) $250. To compare, CCF T11 only has one strip, no bag and no water bottle so the comparative figure would be closer to $100.
Total cost to take part in the program - $430
Cost per session - $21.50

Soccerpro - 10 sessions plus training shirt $190
Cost per session - $19.00

Arsenal Soccer Schools - 10 sessions plus strip $220
Cost per sessions - $22.00

CCF - 10 sessions plus 6-7 games plus one Uhlsport Strip and ball $99
Cost per session (based on 16)  $6.20

This is not making a comparison of the quality of any of the programs - just of the costs involved.  The Target 11 program is specifically designed to develop players tactical and game based awareness and understanding of concepts and principles of elite level football, as well as improve their technical ability. The end result is the identification and selection of 3 squads of players with the ability to compete at a higher level of football.

A couple of things.

If CCF is an incorporated association, copies of the financial statements will be available to members.

If CCF has a non-profit objective (and I'd walk naked up Mann St wearing a backpack full of funnel webs if they didn't) there can be no 'profit'. They might run a surplus from time to time which can be only reinvested into advancing the objectives of the Association.

The CCF is not an incorporated association - it is a company limited by guarantee. But you are correct - any surplus, that at present is going into retiring accumulated debt, is generally reinvested into the association. There are no dividends paid out and there are certainly no huge private profits being made from anything run by the Association.

 

[Loki]

Geoff could you please show me where I can find the breakdown of the Target 11 funds? Also can a player make next years Lightning 11's without being a part of this system.

 

[masmariner]

One thing Geoff do you know when the canteen will be back up and running hasn't the current situation been costing the CCF a lot of $$$, what does the canteen normally make per year approximately. ?