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Turbulence (then calm sailing, then turbulence) thread.

MrCelery

Well-Known Member
What worries me is that the whole drama is a bit deja vu for me. I went through this with Newcastle KB United, and again with Newcastle Breakers. The similarities are many (eg. financial worries though under-funding and over-capitalisation. Small market, limited media avenues, etc.) But so are the differences. So I really hope that the final outcome is nothing like that experienced up north.
 

nebakke

Well-Known Member
Dunno... Last week, Charlesworth was referred to as being very committed to keeping the club alive and well, on the coast. I'd like to think that is indeed the case, but yes, have to admit, it is hard not to be a bit jaded. Especially considering one obvious option for not releasing a broad plan here and now, could be that a potential partial move could be on the cards, in which case they would likely start haemorrhaging fans sooner rather than later.
On the other hand, it could also simply be a function of the deal only having been enacted yesterday and everyone just settling in.
On the positive, Charlesworth was already a major share holder, if he was intent on selling to a South Melbourne consortium like that, looking at what SBS was reporting, I'm not sure I understand why he'd be going through the pain of taking this over first, wouldn't he, logically, just have convinced Gorman and PT to sell it with him? Even if they objected, it's not like it makes a huge difference for them to sell to him and then sell to Melbourne later.
I know they say that he's likely looking to sell on, but I'm wondering if this couldn't be about avoiding that exact deal in favor of something like "The Russians(tm)" in stead (The Russians here being a metaphor for someone from out of country obviously ;) ).
This is obviously speculative speculation of the most speculative nature, as I have absolutely no concept of the day-to-day considerations of running a club or dealing with its financials.... Well it's that combined with a good portion hope and quite a bit of that apprehensive feeling that a little kid has when they want their parents to tell them everything's alright ;)
 

Gratis

Well-Known Member
whilst i know nothing about it the whole thing has struck me as simply being -
* Charlesworth steps up to secure the club and to guarantee wages etc., but
* doesn't want to bankroll it himself forever, so
* buys majority with full intention to garner further investment, ideally a majority sale to a 'russians', and
* these guys - PT, LG & MC - know something we all don't, most likely the full story behind the 'russians' (also used to mean alternative/likely foreign investors), with the high likelihood there are blatant plans in the waters that, not being done deals, can't be aired as yet.

Not concerned about the CoE, it's the usual stuff that goes on with these sorts of developments and is rolled into the above.
Considering how much of PT & MCs' personal money has been injected into keeping CCM afloat I don't believe for a second they'll let it go down the chute with any ease.
 

Ancient Mariner

Well-Known Member
I think it is obvious reading between the lines that the Russians were and are still the favoured outcome.

The problem came to a head when out of the current owners MC was the only one who could afford to put more money into the club to keep it viable, hence the debt for equity deal.

Hopefully MC can keep the club going comfortably until the Russians can get their money on the table.

I suspect the talk with Melbourne was a plan B, C or D as an alternative to extinction.
 

promdi442

Well-Known Member
Asian Cup games will be played in Newcastle Surely the C of E will play host to one of the teams or maybe more during the group stages. I will be happy for the AZKALS to be quartered at the C of E if they qualify and are playing in Newcastle
 

Jesus

Jesus
I think it is obvious reading between the lines that the Russians were and are still the favoured outcome.

The problem came to a head when out of the current owners MC was the only one who could afford to put more money into the club to keep it viable, hence the debt for equity deal.

Hopefully MC can keep the club going comfortably until the Russians can get their money on the table.

I suspect the talk with Melbourne was a plan B, C or D as an alternative to extinction.


I did not see it reported anywhere in NSW, but on the ultimate a-league app they had a link to a story from geelong at the time of the rumour of them wanting the license.
Found the article

http://www.geelongadvertiser.com.au/article/2013/03/20/361429_local_sports.html

It had a quote from the FFA, "A FFA spokesman said yesterday a third team in Victoria was not in the league's expansion plans, but did not rule out considering the city in the future.
"We are not interested in relocating the Central Coast Mariners and we don't have the right to either," the spokesman said.
"They are a Gosford-based club and will remain that way."
The FFA also said it was happy with Melbourne Heart's progress in trying to gain a foothold in Victory territory."
 

MrCelery

Well-Known Member
Charlesworth predicts bright future for Mariners Wednesday, 27 March 2013 4:39 PM

http://www.footballaustralia.com.au...rth-predicts-bright-future-for-mariners/63939

New Central Coast Mariners owner Mike Charlesworth - a lifelong Leeds United fan born-and-raised in Cheshire, England - speaks to footballaustralia.com.au associate editor Michael Cockerill in his first major interview since taking a controlling interest in the Hyundai A-League club this week.

Q. First up Mike, congratulations or commiserations?
A. Let's put a positive hat on and say congratulations. It's a wonderful challenge I've taken on board, the club deserve it, and I'm very much looking forward to it. I can genuinely say that.

It's going to be very exciting times. As far as the football club is concerned, the most important thing now is there is a sound financial footing. We can move on from the financial difficulties we've had - let's face it - for the last year or two.

I've made the commitment to keep the club running, and that includes the all-important Tuggerah development as well - so now we can really focus on the really important things, which are, hopefully, winning the Premier's Plate on Saturday, and then the Grand Final.

Q. In terms of housekeeping, was the first priority to get the players and coaching staff paid?
A. Absolutely. That was the difficulty in terms of the time constraints we had in getting the deal over the line. The players and coaches have been paid, but clearly it was difficult to pay them until the deal was put in place.

We all worked towards it in the end, but it was a difficult process and perhaps a bit more complex than we all thought it would be, which is why it took an extra couple of days. But we're all moving in the right direction, we needed to come to an agreement as far as the club is concerned, and we got there in the end.

Q. It's not the first time player payment issues have surfaced at the Mariners. Are you confident these issues will no longer be a recurring theme?
A. I'm very confident that now we've got the plan in place we can be very positive about the future, and that means the finances as well. That doesn't mean we will not be seeking assistance in terms of the people who are involved in the club apart from myself, like the two (Wyong and Gosford) councils. We want extra value from everybody involved in football in Australia, and that includes the FFA.

Everybody has to come to the party. I don't think it's right that an individual from England should be carrying the financial can for football on the (Central) coast. There are a number of people we'll be asking to come forward, but we're very confident of a successful future for the Mariners, put it that way.

Q. You are now the majority shareholder, but you have been an investor in the club for the past three years, which gave you the opportunity to do a lot of homework before you jumped in. What is your general view of the Hyundai A-League at the moment?
A. What I have invested in here is largely the future of the league. To me, if you look at football in Australia at this point in time, what's happened at the Wanderers is a great success story. Everyone's talking about it.

Maybe people are starting to get more interested in the Wanderers than the Socceroos, and to me that was demonstrated last night (World Cup qualifier against Oman). That's what we're investing in, football in Australia from the grassroots right through to the professional code, and eventually the Socceroos.

Statistically football is growing, relatively quickly, and I see a huge future. As long as we keep going in the right direction, that's fine. Yes, certain changes have to take place, but that applies to all business. The general direction of the A-League is good.

Q. What sort of leadership can we expect from you in terms of the Mariners? Are you going to be fighting for the club publicly or will you be staying in the background?
A. I'll certainly be fighting for the club publically. I've got my other jobs, and I spend maybe half my time overseas, unfortunately. So Peter (Turnbull) will remain chairman. He knows football inside-out; it runs through his blood, he knows the ethos, the character and the culture of the Mariners, so it's important he stays part of the team. But I'll certainly be more involved, especially from a strategic point of view.

Q. People usually describe the Mariners as the smallest club in the competition. Is that the way you see it?
A. Let's face the facts. We're the smallest in terms of the so-called catchment area. We're based in Gosford, which is the smallest centre compared to all the other major cities. So in that respect, we are small. People say we punch above our weight, and we've been doing that for eight years.

But that's not really how we see it. We see that we are one of the top teams in the A-League - we believe that, and we expect that. Our standards are incredibly high, we expect to be fighting for honours every season. We've got a great tradition now, a great heart, a great culture, and that will continue. We're not any less ambitious that anyone else, perhaps we're more ambitious. Success breeds success. That will continue.

Q. How important is Graham Arnold to your plans, especially in the short term?
A. It's safe to say Graham is the best coach in the A-League, without a doubt. It's only a matter of time before he gets offered a big contract in Europe, and it will be very difficult for us to stand in his way, although we will try.

A big club will eventually offer him the sort of challenge he will want. But nobody in Australia will be able to tempt him away, I'd think that's a safe bet.
 

bobandbill

Well-Known Member
Meanwhile: http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/news/1145588/Charlesworth-wants-clubs-to-have-greater-influence

Central Coast Mariners saviour Mike Charlesworth believes football’s grassroots revenues should go to the clubs – not Australia's state federations – in a radical plan he believes would secure the long-term viability of the A-League.

The telecommunications whiz, whose financial muscle has saved the Mariners from sinking, wants to see A-League clubs at the apex of the football pyramid, with the funds from junior registrations throughout Australia funnelled into their coffers to sustain the sport.

The Englishman, a devoted Leeds fan who also plays the game regularly at a social level, has also called for Football Federation Australia to give the club's greater autonomy, insisting the competition is "nearing a crossroads" as it heads towards the climax of season eight of the A-League.

Charlesworth, whose "substantial" cash injection has also secured the future the Mariners' faltering Tuggerah Centre of Excellence development, contends that for the first time the A-League is outshining the fading lustre of the Socceroos, and the ruling body must capitalise on its popularity.

"It's all about making the clubs sustainable so that investors are attracted to the product for the long-term, and I think we need to look at how the kids across Australia are being managed," he said.

"I believe that every player within the catchment area of an A-League club should see his registration fees go to that club instead of the state federations who have plenty of money and are sitting on it.

"Having successful clubs is crucial to the future of the game and they need to be properly funded in a structured manner. If there is no professional club on the Central Coast then everybody suffers.

"Kids should play under the banner of the clubs. Why do we have to have two bodies running the game? Surely the clubs should take precedence and should control and manage the juniors from the rep teams right the way through to the A-League.

"It would add great value to the clubs' bottom lines and bring in sponsors.

"The competition has a great opportunity. You have a situation now where the A-League is attracting more interest than the Socceroos.

"The national team has attracted all the attention in the past but that is changing.

Look at the impact Western Sydney Wanderers have had. Right now people are talking about the A-League more than the national team."

While committed to the Mariners’ cause for the long-haul, Charlesworth, insists the model of the wealthy owner endlessly tipping money into a "black hole" could be kryptonite to the competition.

"As a league we are almost at a crossroads," added the man who has emerged from the shadows after three years on the Mariners board to take the majority shareholding from long-time sugar daddy Peter Turnbull.

"Club owners have collectively probably had enough and need assistance from the FFA in letting us run our own affairs. It's no good relying on wealthy individuals continually putting their hands in their pockets, as I did to bail out Central Coast and pay players' wages.

"Clubs need a greater influence on how the competition is run and how and where the money is spent. When you have that you will have more people willing to invest.

"No owner comes into the game expecting to make money but you don't want to lose huge amounts either. I would be a happy man if I could get this club to break even."

Charlesworth has vowed to clear debts owed to the Australian Tax Office and to creditors at the Centre of Excellence development, which he says will be complete in two years and will raise significant revenue for the club.

And he will keep an open door to future investors should they emerge.

"I am confident we are heading in the right direction now and won't have situations again where we are late playing players and such like," he said.

"We will get the Centre of Excellence up and running and within a couple of years and that will include an office block, a hotel and an aquatic centre to go along the five and seven-a-side pitches.

"There's a lot of positivity about the place now and people are smiling again. But like any club in the world we will remain open to further backers should they come forward. Whether they are from Russia, China or whatever. If they show an interest we will talk."
 

FFC Mariner

Well-Known Member
He's right about the Socceroos.

Last night was horrible. 35,000 mutes and it was like an NRL crowd.

Players didn't seem bothered, crowd weren't bothered and there is more atmosphere at an Aleague game with a crowd of 7,000 than dished up by the FFA/GGA partnership.
 

Jesus

Jesus
Socceroos being back on FTA will help them attract punters through the gates. But the tactics employed will drive them away
 

kevrenor

Well-Known Member

adz

Moderator
Staff member
""Kids should play under the banner of the clubs. Why do we have to have two bodies running the game? Surely the clubs should take precedence and should control and manage the juniors from the rep teams right the way through to the A-League .."

What the? Has he totally missed the Competitions review and National Premier Leagues?

I thought that was mainly about player development. Does that put money into the clubs?
 

dibo

Well-Known Member
Mr Charlesworth might not realise that there aren't exactly rivers of gold coming from grassroots football.

In NSW, FNSW draws approximately $9 million from 200,000 grassroots players. FFA draws about $3 million.

If Mr Charlesworth thinks that the three A-League clubs in the FNSW territory (for example) can help themselves to $12 million to fill holes in their revenues or balance sheets I think he will be sorely disappointed.

It's not like he can transfer all the money over to run elite development programs and the like without carrying across some cost.

The model effectively looks more like CCMA (where grassroots footballers are funding a NPL NSW club through their association) rather than CCMFC getting its hands on a bucket of money.

These sums going to FNSW and FFA are also the source of *considerable* discontent among grassroots players, parents and officials and so, with a growing backlash building against what are effectively taxes on grassroots players.

To maintain these fees and redirect them to themselves, A-League clubs would have to make a pretty good argument for why they would be doing something different and better and we wouldn't just be changing the faces on the dartboards.
 

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