R15: Nix v CCM @ the Caketun

[Forum Phoenix]

I swear In saw their heads drop after Wee Mac potted home his goal and never lift again.....and how about the corner ratio...what did Nux get 10 or 11 imagine if they scored with just a percentage of those, it could of been 4 or 5 nil.....absolutely horrible defenders, zero creative process by them, it was just a case of "f**kit, lets kick it out and prey we survive the impending corner".... Willingtun Phunux is maori for Mariners Whoo Doo Team of 2016/17

Im starting to think that Paolo isnt all that his cracked up to be , I seem to remember Mossy changing lineups every fkn week , some that made no sense at all...not 100 % sure we will get another spoon, but the odds are looking good

Re Okon: Of our three senior reinforcements for the season (which was never enough) Powell, Faty and Tav - two are out and the other one - usually deployed out of position - was finally benched.

I don't think there's much to it but that we're clearly young thereby mistake prone and under strength.

Dibo nailed it re early goal and nix sitting back after scoring and I think to have to chase a game again really hit the players hard.

Weemac is quality, but Storm should have showed weemac the sideline and never have allowed him to cut onto his right foot. That has nothing to do with Okon. Storm is the best RB we have presently so that is what it is.

Also the nix should not be under estimated imo, agree with Nebbake that they're not pretty or overly cohesive. But man for man, they're either very big, strong and athletic or have serious individual quality. The fact they're not pretty and most of their games are a scrap makes people think they're not that good, but they largely just look like they've been poorly coached - Merrick clearly misfired - whole thing was weird. I reckon if you switch Arnie in for this year, they'd be right up the top of the table.

And I still think they're capable of knocking any of the sides over on their day.

It's not sn excuse, but bottom line that game suited them to a tee. At home, windy, rainy, scored early and we couldn't win a single aerial ball.

Probably what worries me most about that Performance was how poor we were aerially and at set pieces - both defending and our own attacking.

No excuses at professional level for the absolute rubbish we serve up at set pieces.

Worth signing the Argentinian just if he can hit a half decent dead ball alone.

 

[Big Al]

Re Okon: Of our three senior reinforcements for the season (which was never enough) Powell, Faty and Tav - two are out and the other one - usually deployed out of position - was finally benched.

Worth signing the Argentinian just if he can hit a half decent dead ball alone.

However the rumoured targets are not mature either.
GC 23
Mini Messi 21

Paul not really targeting experience, however they are Mariner type protégés.

We were alright in 2nd half just had no one to take game by scruff of the neck and make it ours

 

[pjennings]

However the rumoured targets are not mature either.
GC 23
Mini Messi 21

Paul not really targeting experience, however they are Mariner type protégés.

We were alright in 2nd half just had no one to take game by scruff of the neck and make it ours

GC?

 

[JoyfulPenguin]

GC?

Giancarlo Gallifuoco I assume.

 

[Pirate Pete]

Giancarlo Gallifuoco I assume.

Wasn't in Torquays team this week. Actually hasn't played since December 26, and then he was subbed at 57 minutes

 

[Wombat]

FourFourTwo Review of the game:
http://www.a-league.com.au/article/...tral-coast-mariners/w2bo6gjp6wbw1bd4xoahul66m

Jesus................we had one shot on target in 90 mins...........................that is sub pathetic.
Excuse Izzo and Monty.....they can enjoy Tapas at Terrigal. The rest should be flogged at training all week. Okon should be flogged too as that was below a very low bar set by Moss and Tony.

 

[Big Al]

Giancarlo Gallifuoco I assume.

Yeah my bad GG not GC

 

[dibo]

Jesus................we had one shot on target in 90 mins...........................that is sub pathetic.

I love stats but one stay doesn't tell the whole story.

 

[Wombat]

I love stats but one stay doesn't tell the whole story.

It did in that game Dibo.
We were f**king woeful.
Very lucky to have only lost 1.0 against an average side.
We were good for 10 minutes.

 

[tim...]

Can't be arsed looking back but did anyone notice our good friends at Fox spent the majority of the half-hour pre game show fluffing on about the derby happening after our game?

So incredibly frustrating and degrading as I doubt too much of the audience watching were doing so for the derby.

 

[nebakke]

Can't be arsed looking back but did anyone notice our good friends at Fox spent the majority of the half-hour pre game show fluffing on about the derby happening after our game?

So incredibly frustrating and degrading as I doubt too much of the audience watching were doing so for the derby.

Yeah - not the first time either... There's a couple of things about Fox's coverage approach that really s***s me, this is one of them... It's not exclusively done to us either though
But if I'm watching a game, it's usually because I'm somewhat interested in that game... I might want to watch the derby after as well, but that's for after... This bulls**t thing they do, where they do a PiP in the corner, DURING THE FSCKING GAME, showing the players for the next, bigger, game arriving on the bus sh*ts me no end - I don't need to see a guy walking while listening to music...
And at halftime I want some decent analysis of the game that I'm watching, not a bunch of conjecture about the game that'll be on next.. Especially not when they've stopped going directly from one game to another anyway.

The other BIG thing for mine, is the way they handle the cameras during the game - it's f*****g amateur-level sometimes... They'll mention a player after he let the ball roll over the side-line or something, then cut to show that player - clearly frustrated that something didn't go to plan... Then they'll follow him for what feels like an eternity, while talking about his life-story... By the time they cut back, the opposite team has somehow gotten the ball and is on the attack at the other end and they'll just briefly comment on a turnover, as if we all saw it, and then move on.
Even more so when they're showing the bloody RBB doing the bloody Poznan - they'll cut to them even if a fast moving attack is on the go - leaving the viewer to try to guess what's going on .
I'm assuming it's because the producers all came from NRL, and so, expect more hold-ups and slow downs in play, but it can SO infuriate me at times.

 

[Pirate Pete]

I had to listen to the commentary on BBC grandstand for the Victory game as I was in the car.
The Sh*te they talked about was unbelievable. Five minute conversation about Mariners ex goalkeepers at one point.
I had no idea was happening in the game.

 

[Capn Gus Bloodbeard]

I love stats but one stay doesn't tell the whole story.

What story is there to tell other than our attack couldn't get their act together enough to take a shot?
That's the sort of stat we'd see each week under TW. Haven't seen anything like that this season as far as I can remember

 

[Tevor]

We are a two faced team, our home verse away performances are totally opposite. It's been happening all season apart from round 1. Young side maybe but we look woeful away from CCM. Nux would only have one win if it wasn't for us, and we play our only home game against them at Canberra. There have been some good sumations on the players and I agree so no need to mention anything further.

Really struggling to see where that third win is coming from.

 

[dibo]

What story is there to tell other than our attack couldn't get their act together enough to take a shot?
That's the sort of stat we'd see each week under TW. Haven't seen anything like that this season as far as I can remember

Really?

I've already posted in some detail about why this weekend was different to the last couple of games. Not everything is about one stat, or even about our performance. The tactics or the performance of the other team has a major bearing as well.

Just because a team isn't unbeaten at the top of the table doesn't mean they can't be set up or perform in such a fashion that makes life harder for us than a table-topper.

Focussing on one stat alone blinds us to the fact that there was a very clear tactical difference between the high-pressing Melbourne City and Sydney who left room in behind for us to play in behind and the very deep-lying and defensively minded Wellington. We didn't get the space to cut across the park with aggressive diagonal balls against Wellington that we had the previous two weeks, and we didn't get the room to play balls in behind either.

*That* is why we got only one shot on target. There were plenty of attempts to get the ball to someone in a shooting position, but those attempts were generally trying to pick out one or two players surrounded by two CBs and two DMs who dropped in to crush the available space.

But looking at the A-League site's stats, we won 9 corners to 5, so clearly we were getting to positions where we forced them to clear. And now that I look further, We had 54% possession, we won 60% of aerial duels and split duels across the park 50:50 (not bad when we're playing against a physically imposing side) we made more passes, we had as many crosses (though not accurate crosses).

And now that I'm looking at it - the A-League site has us on 8 shots total, 6 on target (vs 21 shots, of which 6 were on target). No wonder Wombat's quoting of a stat grated against my sense of how the game went - the stat was simply wrong.

We had only one shot from outside the box, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and suggest that maybe he read the wrong line.

But it only goes to underline the point that we need to be careful with stats; if we're not careful we wind up using them like a drunk uses a lamppost; for support rather than illumination (with apologies to Mark Twain). We need to watch the game as well, and not only watch what we do but what the other side does too.

 

[Big Al]

Really?

But looking at the A-League site's stats, we won 9 corners to 5, so clearly we were getting to positions where we forced them to clear. And now that I look further, We had 54% possession, we won 60% of aerial duels and split duels across the park 50:50 (not bad when we're playing against a physically imposing side) we made more passes, we had as many crosses (though not accurate crosses).

And now that I'm looking at it - the A-League site has us on 8 shots total, 6 on target (vs 21 shots, of which 6 were on target). No wonder Wombat's quoting of a stat grated against my sense of how the game went - the stat was simply wrong.

We had only one shot from outside the box, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and suggest that maybe he read the wrong line.
.

During coverage had corners 10-2 in nix favour, so someone's stats are out and 6 on target no way.

We never looked like scoring and can't win if you don't score.

However we weren't as bad in the 2nd half had plenty of attacking possession just couldn't turn it into opportunities which is not the first time this season, was a problem early in season

 

[dibo]

I agree that we didn't look like scoring, and I've outlined what I think are the reasons for that. I don't think we were that different to the week before, and I definitely wouldn't tag our defence as the issue. There were some individual performances that weren't great.

Buhagiar, for example, gave away the ball *a lot*. He had a pretty poor game by his standards. Ferreira was also wasteful. O'Donovan was anonymous *but* that's because he was being monstered by two CBs far bigger than him and there was no space behind them to attack, so he was effectively played out of the game. Appiah tried hard but his leg speed outdid his touch more than once. So there's our starting front 4 all missing the beat.

We did OK when bringing fullbacks into the game, but the issue there is that if they're bombing on, the ideal attacking play is a cross (because it's hard to play them into an already incredibly congested central area) but our crossing was poor and we did not have a single player suited to getting on the end of a cross in a tight area.

And then with fullbacks overcommitted, we'd get stretched covering counterattacks.

There've been a few times this year where I've felt that the best thing we can do is hang onto the ball on our side of halfway to try to draw sides out. But that really relies on us *not* falling behind. We can play through a side that tries to press (though against Sydney away in October we were torn apart but we've improved massively since then).

But once we're behind, we're really forced to try to play, and we struggle to force the agenda against sides that are happy to give up the ball and play a defensive game.

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Really?

I've already posted in some detail about why this weekend was different to the last couple of games. Not everything is about one stat, or even about our performance. The tactics or the performance of the other team has a major bearing as well.

Just because a team isn't unbeaten at the top of the table doesn't mean they can't be set up or perform in such a fashion that makes life harder for us than a table-topper.

Focussing on one stat alone blinds us to the fact that there was a very clear tactical difference between the high-pressing Melbourne City and Sydney who left room in behind for us to play in behind and the very deep-lying and defensively minded Wellington. We didn't get the space to cut across the park with aggressive diagonal balls against Wellington that we had the previous two weeks, and we didn't get the room to play balls in behind either.

*That* is why we got only one shot on target. There were plenty of attempts to get the ball to someone in a shooting position, but those attempts were generally trying to pick out one or two players surrounded by two CBs and two DMs who dropped in to crush the available space.

But looking at the A-League site's stats, we won 9 corners to 5, so clearly we were getting to positions where we forced them to clear. And now that I look further, We had 54% possession, we won 60% of aerial duels and split duels across the park 50:50 (not bad when we're playing against a physically imposing side) we made more passes, we had as many crosses (though not accurate crosses).

And now that I'm looking at it - the A-League site has us on 8 shots total, 6 on target (vs 21 shots, of which 6 were on target). No wonder Wombat's quoting of a stat grated against my sense of how the game went - the stat was simply wrong.

We had only one shot from outside the box, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and suggest that maybe he read the wrong line.

But it only goes to underline the point that we need to be careful with stats; if we're not careful we wind up using them like a drunk uses a lamppost; for support rather than illumination (with apologies to Mark Twain). We need to watch the game as well, and not only watch what we do but what the other side does too.

Great post. But speaking of the worth of stats... absolutely gob smacked that we won 60% of aerial duels?? Certainly wasn't on Wellingtons corners.

I actually read that 1 shot on target stat somewhere too though, think it was Fox match centre. And I'm sure it wasn't listed as outside the box..

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Ok someone's giving out dodgy stats Dibo. Just went to fox match centre.

Fox has us with 1on target 3 off target - 1 blocked total of 5.

Welly - 6 on - 7 off - 1 blocked. Total 14

Corners Welly 11 us 3

They won almost twice as many tackles..,

It doesn't list aerial/headers though

But these are at direct odds with your stats right?

 

[tim...]

Stats from the HAL website:
Possession % - CCM 55-45
Duels success % - CCM 54-46
Aerial duels won % - WEL 60-40
Interceptions WEL 34 CCM 22
Offsides WEL 2 CCM 0
Corners WEL 11 CCM 3
Crosses WEL 22 CCM 15
Crossing accuracy WEL 27% CCM 20%
Shots/on target WEL 14/7, CCM 5/1
Blocked shots WEL 2 CCM 1
Shots outside box WEL 2 CCM 2
Shots inside box WEL 12 CCM 3
Shooting accuracy WEL 50% CCM 20%