Turbulence (then calm sailing, then turbulence) thread.

[dibo]

How would it work?

I don't know, only that there have been rumours of a community model for a while and it would be interesting to see it actually come out of the shadows.

I know that I'm deeply sceptical about the potential for a capital raising like what Middy talks about above, where 6000 people essentially pay $300 on top of their memberships for three years.

I feel as if there's a model like a large association or company limited by guarantee to run it with directors elected by members, you'd have a huge incentive for people to become and stay members (even if they don't necessarily get to a lot of games). AFL clubs are generally companies limited by guarantee.

The problem is getting enough members to raise enough money to be able to make it work. This is where you can get a little bit cute. 'Members' can be either natural persons or corporations. You could have a Supporters' Association to serve as one member of the Company. Members of the Supporters' Association wouldn't be members of the Company, but they would have a channel for their voice to be heard directly.

The other members might be organisations like (and this is somewhere between an educated guess and pulling names from my arse) CCF, Central Coast Leagues Club, Gosford City Council, Wyong Shire Council, Central Coast Chamber of Commerce & Industry...

You might ask each to raise 1/6 of the cash to purchase the club (so let's assume that that is $1 million each). 5,000 members at $200 a pop would raise the Supporters' Trust's amount.

But then, even if the licence were gifted to the company, the company would still need to be able to raise $1 million per annum *in addition* to what we currently earn just to keep things rolling for the next couple of years.

There'll be a lawyer floating around who'll shoot holes in it or someone who knows a bit more about the balance sheets of any of those organisations, but that's how I imagine you'd put it together.

 

[Capt. Awesome]

I don't know, only that there have been rumours of a community model for a while and it would be interesting to see it actually come out of the shadows.

I know that I'm deeply sceptical about the potential for a capital raising like what Middy talks about above, where 6000 people essentially pay $300 on top of their memberships for three years.

I feel as if there's a model like a large association or company limited by guarantee to run it with directors elected by members, you'd have a huge incentive for people to become and stay members (even if they don't necessarily get to a lot of games). AFL clubs are generally companies limited by guarantee.

The problem is getting enough members to raise enough money to be able to make it work. This is where you can get a little bit cute. 'Members' can be either natural persons or corporations. You could have a Supporters' Association to serve as one member of the Company. Members of the Supporters' Association wouldn't be members of the Company, but they would have a channel for their voice to be heard directly.

The other members might be organisations like (and this is somewhere between an educated guess and pulling names from my arse) CCF, Central Coast Leagues Club, Gosford City Council, Wyong Shire Council, Central Coast Chamber of Commerce & Industry...

You might ask each to raise 1/6 of the cash to purchase the club (so let's assume that that is $1 million each). 5,000 members at $200 a pop would raise the Supporters' Trust's amount.

But then, even if the licence were gifted to the company, the company would still need to be able to raise $1 million per annum *in addition* to what we currently earn just to keep things rolling for the next couple of years.

There'll be a lawyer floating around who'll shoot holes in it or someone who knows a bit more about the balance sheets of any of those organisations, but that's how I imagine you'd put it together.

After all millions MC has put into the club would he really want to walk away with a loss?

 

[scottmac]

In all honesty, this should have been done by LM as soon as he took the mayors post. Having the mayor associated directly was a conflict of interest & as noted excluded him from anything related to ccm.
Not taking anything away from what he's given to the club. Just something that's long overdue.

Then he could have spoken out earlier about exactly how he feels the club should be serving the community rather than a veiled swipe that will go over most people's heads.

 

[dibo]

So Ray Gatt reckons we've hired Peter Storrie as a consultant.

Not sure who Peter Storrie is?

Portsmouth chief Peter Storrie admits the money has run out as players go without pay
By SPORTSMAIL REPORTER
UPDATED: 01:50 AEST, 2 October 2009

Portsmouth chief executive Peter Storrie says there is 'no money left' to run the club following Sportsmail's revelations that players had not been paid last month.

And Storrie admits that he has 'no idea' when the Premier League strugglers financial woes will be sorted out.

Portsmouth are waiting on new owner Sulaiman Al Fahim to deliver on a promise to channel £50million into the club.

Cash shortage: Portsmouth chief executive Peter Storrie (left) and new owner Sulaiman Al Fahim

'All the money from all the player transfers and the Sky TV money, all of the £35m from January, has gone straight to the Standard Bank,' Storrie told ESPN. 'There is no money left.

'Whatever we spend on a monthly basis comes channelled through from the new owner.

'He has promised to re-finance, and he has shown me all the documentation, but I have no idea about the conditions of the £50m he says will be arriving in a few weeks.

'We need to re-finance, it is as simple as that. As for the players wages for the last month I would imagine it's a blip and they will be paid, but I have spent the last nine to 10 months fighting fires on a daily basis, I'm not giving up.'

Morale is already low at Fratton Park following seven straight defeats that leaves Portsmouth rooted to the bottom of the Premier League without a single point.

Show me the money: David James is among the Portsmouth players who haven't been paid

And now players have sought explanations after their wages did not land in their bank as normal on Wednesday, the last working day of the month. The club have confirmed the problems, but insist that wages will be paid in the next two days.

'Portsmouth FC can confirm that the first-team squad and executive board was not paid,' they said in a statement.

'The club is currently being refinanced by the owner Sulaiman Al Fahim following the recent completion of his takeover.

Hampered: Pompey boss Paul Hart has toiled on a small budget

'There was a delay in the transfer of funds but the lawyers have received confirmation that this will happen today (Thursday) which will enable the players to be paid within the next 24 to 48 hours. The players have all been informed of the situation.

'The executive board will continue to help the new owner in his efforts to refinance which has come about as a direct consequence of the banks' requirements to retain all television receipts and profits generated during the transfer windows.'

Hart echoed the club's sentiments and insisted the players would not be distracted as they prepare for Saturday's visit to Wolverhampton Wanderers.

'It's a hiccup and a cash-flow problem,' said Hart. 'We explained to the players in a meeting we will receive the rest by tomorrow (Friday) - and the players are happy with that. They will get on with their jobs.

'You put one fire out and another starts up in the corner. That's how it has been in my tenure as manager.

'But you can spit your dummy out and throw your toys out of the pram, or take it as another fire, put it out and get going again.

'It has been a particularly interesting day from about 8.30 this morning - nothing I can tell you about. But you have choices. You either stick together and get through it or stamp your feet.'

Storrie has considered his position over a fraught last few weeks, but he says he is determined to stay at the south coast club after receiving the support of fans.

'Yes I thought about going, but that reception from the fans, how could I go after that,' he said. 'Yes, we have been very close to administration a few times in the last nine to 10 months, but I am not about to give up now.

'I've no idea of the timescale about how long this can go on. I don't want to frighten people. I am sure that if the re-financing that has been promised fails for some reason there will be other people ready to step in.

'There is only so much we can do, by that I mean, the present staff, we are all wholly reliant on the re-financing. Our jobs are to keep everything going until then, and of course I remain hopeful that this club will survive.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1217406/Portsmouth-chief-Peter-Storrie-admits-money-run-players-pay.html#ixzz3Kd5mUn2l

Portsmouth were once a Premiership club but following adminstration and a fan-led bailout where they nearly ceased to exist entirely, they're stuck mid-table in League 2.

Might need to get cracking on that supporters' trust.

 

[Luke]

What a day huh? Just another day in the life of a Mariners fan.

Sigh.

 

[Capt. Awesome]

So Ray Gatt reckons we've hired Peter Storrie as a consultant.

Not sure who Peter Storrie is?

Portsmouth chief Peter Storrie admits the money has run out as players go without pay
By SPORTSMAIL REPORTER
UPDATED: 01:50 AEST, 2 October 2009

Portsmouth chief executive Peter Storrie says there is 'no money left' to run the club following Sportsmail's revelations that players had not been paid last month.

And Storrie admits that he has 'no idea' when the Premier League strugglers financial woes will be sorted out.

Portsmouth are waiting on new owner Sulaiman Al Fahim to deliver on a promise to channel £50million into the club.

Cash shortage: Portsmouth chief executive Peter Storrie (left) and new owner Sulaiman Al Fahim

'All the money from all the player transfers and the Sky TV money, all of the £35m from January, has gone straight to the Standard Bank,' Storrie told ESPN. 'There is no money left.

'Whatever we spend on a monthly basis comes channelled through from the new owner.

'He has promised to re-finance, and he has shown me all the documentation, but I have no idea about the conditions of the £50m he says will be arriving in a few weeks.

'We need to re-finance, it is as simple as that. As for the players wages for the last month I would imagine it's a blip and they will be paid, but I have spent the last nine to 10 months fighting fires on a daily basis, I'm not giving up.'

Morale is already low at Fratton Park following seven straight defeats that leaves Portsmouth rooted to the bottom of the Premier League without a single point.

Show me the money: David James is among the Portsmouth players who haven't been paid

And now players have sought explanations after their wages did not land in their bank as normal on Wednesday, the last working day of the month. The club have confirmed the problems, but insist that wages will be paid in the next two days.

'Portsmouth FC can confirm that the first-team squad and executive board was not paid,' they said in a statement.

'The club is currently being refinanced by the owner Sulaiman Al Fahim following the recent completion of his takeover.

Hampered: Pompey boss Paul Hart has toiled on a small budget

'There was a delay in the transfer of funds but the lawyers have received confirmation that this will happen today (Thursday) which will enable the players to be paid within the next 24 to 48 hours. The players have all been informed of the situation.

'The executive board will continue to help the new owner in his efforts to refinance which has come about as a direct consequence of the banks' requirements to retain all television receipts and profits generated during the transfer windows.'

Hart echoed the club's sentiments and insisted the players would not be distracted as they prepare for Saturday's visit to Wolverhampton Wanderers.

'It's a hiccup and a cash-flow problem,' said Hart. 'We explained to the players in a meeting we will receive the rest by tomorrow (Friday) - and the players are happy with that. They will get on with their jobs.

'You put one fire out and another starts up in the corner. That's how it has been in my tenure as manager.

'But you can spit your dummy out and throw your toys out of the pram, or take it as another fire, put it out and get going again.

'It has been a particularly interesting day from about 8.30 this morning - nothing I can tell you about. But you have choices. You either stick together and get through it or stamp your feet.'

Storrie has considered his position over a fraught last few weeks, but he says he is determined to stay at the south coast club after receiving the support of fans.

'Yes I thought about going, but that reception from the fans, how could I go after that,' he said. 'Yes, we have been very close to administration a few times in the last nine to 10 months, but I am not about to give up now.

'I've no idea of the timescale about how long this can go on. I don't want to frighten people. I am sure that if the re-financing that has been promised fails for some reason there will be other people ready to step in.

'There is only so much we can do, by that I mean, the present staff, we are all wholly reliant on the re-financing. Our jobs are to keep everything going until then, and of course I remain hopeful that this club will survive.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1217406/Portsmouth-chief-Peter-Storrie-admits-money-run-players-pay.html#ixzz3Kd5mUn2l

Portsmouth were once a Premiership club but following adminstration and a fan-led bailout where they nearly ceased to exist entirely, they're stuck mid-table in League 2.

Might need to get cracking on that supporters' trust.

This peter Storrie guy might be good for the club. If Portsmouth ended in community ownership after he failed then so might we.

 

[scottmac]

Didn't Portsmouth's collapse coincide with the virtual replacement of their first team at considerable expense?

 

[Capt. Awesome]

If we want to keep our club we have to mobilise now. Everyone should start lobbying Mckinna to help initiate a community ownership model. If you have twitter or FB hit him and start the conversation. The time is now!


http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/article/2014/12/01/mckinna-walks-out-mariners

The Mariners' first coach - who took the club to two A-League grand finals - quit his position as ambassador in the wake of owner and chairman Mike Charlesworth's drive to take games away from Gosford.

Charlesworth believes the Mariners cannot afford to play all their matches in Gosford and moving some matches to Sydney was the only way to save the club.

The league's smallest club that represents a region of 300,000 people is struggling to draw enough fans to its home games.

The Mariners' average crowd after four home games this season is 7620.

It will play its home game against Melbourne Victory on Friday at North Sydney Oval in a bid for a healthy crowd.

The Mariners will also play another league game at Brookvale Oval later in the season.

McKinna, who is the Mayor of Gosford, is known to be against the new direction the club is taking and is believed to have grown disenchanted with the club's new policies.

McKinna was not prepared to comment on the day's startling events when approached by The World Gamebut after tendering his resignation he said in a statement that the club "used to have the best community model".

A spokesman for the Yellow Army supporters group expressed the sentiments of many within the club's fan base by declaring that the club was losing touch with the community.

"It's his club and Mr Charlesworth can do what he wants with the club," said Simon Fisher, who used to be chairman of the supporters group before he quit his position four months ago due to differences with the club's recent policies.

"But he can't expect the Central Coast community to adopt his idea of moving games from Gosford to Sydney to try to broaden the club's market.

"The club does very little on the Central Coast to maintain their current market, anyway.

"I live on the coast and I know how little they do to engage the community.

"They tried for a couple of weeks to meet the people and they failed and now they are trying a new market."

Fisher said the club was at the crossroads and needed to re-establish its identity.

"These are the most difficult times we've had since we started," Fisher said.

"We've been broke for several years and it looks like we'll be losing more this season despite the Foxtel deal.

"I really do not understand how the club operates.

"As for McKinna, he is in a difficult position. As mayor, how is he supposed to support matches that are taking place in another area?"

The Mariners are in sixth place on the ladder with only one win from eight matches.

 

[Capt. Awesome]

Ok So I don't know how much you can read into this but I posted this of Lawries FB page. He responded quite quickly. By the sounds of it somethings are already in motion. We can only hope.

Hi Lawrie, thanks for everything, you have been such a loyal supporter of our club. I can totally understand your decision on breaking your association with the club after all that has been going on in the past two years with the owner trying to move our club to North Sydney. I can see that you would be very unhappy with this.

I would like to hear your thoughts on any likely avenues that the Central Coast Mariners fans can take to secure a community ownership model for our club. We want it to stay here on the coast as I know you do to. With all your influence on the Coast and with the FFA, can we make this happen???

Would love to hear your thoughts on this as I know of lots of people that would love this to happen and would support it financially.

• Lawrie Mckinna "Cheers keep checking Facebook"

 

[Atomic]

Lawrie and Singo…. you know it makes sense!

 

[true believer]

Lawrie and Singo…. you know it makes sense!

how did singo and newtown end up ?

 

[Atomic]

how did singo and newtown end up ?

Maybe Singo's learnt something in the 30 years since Newtown went belly up

 

[Gratis]

I've thought a few times lately that it's never a boring club to follow

 

[Gratis]

these are indeed turbulent times. in some ways it seems to be coming to a head which is a good feeling if a little scary.
had no idea when starting this thread that it'd be so turbulent so long later
long live king Lawrie!
there appears to be a rallying effect here - and I'm f'kin in.
they may take our home games,
but they will never take
OUR MARINERS!!!

 

[Gratis]

thing is I'm genuinely thankful to MC for pouring literally millions of his own dollars into our club and keeping it going. but it's just not acceptable to be an 80's guy and have no regard for the clubs soul. he wants to be a shark not a sheep so he just won't look back at the clubs history. he can't because sharks don't have necks. necks are for sheep.

 

[Jaundice]

So im of the understanding our losses per annum are around the 1 million dollar mark.

Im wondering for the viability of smaller clubs if the FFA should consider scrapping this minimum spend nonsense or atleast consider dropping it, oh lets say, a million dollars and allowing that TV revenue to support the clubs finances.

Sure, our quality of players would drop but I believe the current system inflates a lot of wages anyway. It would also encourage and demand better youth pathways and opportunity.

Your Sydneys and Melbournes will still spend up big (overpay) so its not as if the league will diminish greatly in talent.

I think this could help A league clubs like us in trouble until they get their house in order.

 

[Paolo]

So im of the understanding our losses per annum are around the 1 million dollar mark.

Im wondering for the viability of smaller clubs if the FFA should consider scrapping this minimum spend nonsense or atleast consider dropping it, oh lets say, a million dollars and allowing that TV revenue to support the clubs finances.

Sure, our quality of players would drop but I believe the current system inflates a lot of wages anyway. It would also encourage and demand better youth pathways and opportunity.

Your Sydneys and Melbournes will still spend up big (overpay) so its not as if the league will diminish greatly in talent.

I think this could help A league clubs like us in trouble until they get their house in order.

You have a very influential stakeholder who wouldn't let something like this happen...the Professional Footballers Association

 

[iEatHands]

So im of the understanding our losses per annum are around the 1 million dollar mark.

MC has only said that the club has AVERAGED $1,000,000 a year over the 10 year period. I'm assuming it is much less now that players wages are covered by FFA and we run on the tightest number of back office staff compared to every other HAL club in existence.

 

[midfielder]

I guess our biggest hope is FFA I don't think will allow a transfer of our licence to a Sydney location...

Read a couple of posts back Simon Fisher has left we know our own Bikini Girl is less involved and now LM has walked ... when you think what could have been done after we won the GF ..

Auburn, Blacktown Demons, Northern Spirit ..... Central Coast Mariners .... just hope the jinx that has followed me on my choice of Football teams does not follow the same pattern ....

Hopes things turn around soon...

However if their is a mover and a shaker out their...

My I suggest something.... Dibo and other mods what about approaching the CCLC for a room one night and we meet to discuss issues and whats involved in a community model... invite the facebook and twitter folk, and LM ... start say 7:00 to 7:15 to give people a chance to get there ..

For me the elephant in the room seems the complex issue that is the COE , with heaps of government money to date and more funds needed, If say the COE via MC kept say 49% of the Mariners Football Cluband the community model 51% with no ownership of the COE ... my guess is a lot of MC's funding has been for the COE and if he keeps that and say half the Football club, he may walk if he does not need to fund the running costs of the Football club... OK I will put the joint out, put the JD back in the bar ... just wondering ... call local radio stations to get the word out as well...

Essentially the COE would stay in the same ownership as now and own 49% of the Football Club, The community would own the other 51% of the Football club, suggested possible investors already mentioned say both local councils, CCLC , Singo and fans...

 

[dibo]

MC has only said that the club has AVERAGED $1,000,000 a year over the 10 year period. I'm assuming it is much less now that players wages are covered by FFA and we run on the tightest number of back office staff compared to every other HAL club in existence.

The TV grant increased by $600k a season from last year ($1.9m a season to $2.5m) when the salary cap increased by just $32k. It now covers the full salary cap, so we should be nearly $600k a season better off.

Part of the problem may be that we're running too thin to be able to do things right. Maybe we're not effectively re-investing that dividend to grow the club.

If you under-spend on commercial services for example, you don't get and service the sponsorships sufficiently to get and keep good sponsors. If you under-spend on marketing and communications you can't let everyone know when you're playing. If you under-spend on community programs and links with the local Association you don't get your easiest market to sell to (local footballers) on board.