Mariners Financial Crisis in the Daily Tele

[true believer]

once again put it out there.
ring the packers and ask them if they'd like to support the community sporting concept.
ring qpr stoke bremen and ask them if they like most favorord status

but don't die on your knee's

 

[dibo]

Having a scheme does not guarantee it will work, no matter who else around the world has them. Our solution needs to be right for us, not just what works in other places.

 

[true believer]

Having a scheme does not guarantee it will work, no matter who else around the world has them. Our solution needs to be right for us, not just what works in other places.

no but have a go.have a go .find the solution . find the f'n door

im a dill .and lets face it so are most of you pussies .get up off the floor amd lead the show.

if it's money. lets start trying to raise it .get some mommentum no matter how small.
sooner or later some whale will land .for their owen self interest .but you've gotta start.
you kiddies have started a web site .well start a save the mariners web site
bob graham,holstien,o'neil they'll all want'ta'b a local hero.

make a stand.

 

[adz]

Anyone want to have a go at deciphering that one? A few more posts like that and we could make it a weekly competition.

 

[Muppet]

What Dibo said

 

[midfielder]

Anyone want to have a go at deciphering that one? A few more posts like that and we could make it a weekly competition.

I think the suggestion is we ... meaning the forum folk ... need to start a fund or start fund raising..

 

[midfielder]

The starting point for any real analysis is to know the extent of the unpaid bills... we have read 12 months group tax and super...

Given our wage bill is around the 2.5 million gross for 23 players ... then a reasonable assumption is the unpaid tax is at best 20% of 2.5 million with another 9% for super... say 30% of 2.5 million or 750 K...

However the great unknown is whether the light bill is paid or the council rates etc.

TBH if the outstanding is a million or thereabouts a totally different set of options are available than if the outstanding are say 3 million...

Until the amount is known speculation on any outcome is foolish .... maybe its time for Peter to send another email giving some information about what the current position is...

 

[adz]

For something to compare it to, Melbourne Demons in the AFL was $5 million dollars in debt only a few years ago. Jim Stynes took over as president in 2008 and started a massive push to clear that debt - bringing in record memberships (37k in 2011), all sorts of fund raising like $200/ticket raffles, expensive dinner/functions ($1,000+/head) etc, etc. All that and the debt was finally cleared last year.

I'm just saying it will take a bit more than "sell shares and have a community club" to turn things around.

 

[dibo]

TB, you talk all tough, but seriously, you gotta think about the practicality. The numbers matter.

We need more capital, a supporters trust ain't gonna do the trick. Take a hint.

 

[elevated position]

With so many clubs falling on financial difficulties it shows that the FFA setup for ALeague clubs is flawed.
How can so many self made businessmen (owners) get it wrong?

 

[dibo]

The issue is persistent losses, so either the revenue bases aren't big enough or costs are too high.the only real option on coasts is reducing wages, which then makes us uncompetitive in the market for players.

So then we come to revenue. We need better gate, corporate and media revenues, and the TV deal is the most obvious fix.

But we still need to have value for broadcasters. SPL rights have just gone off for GBP 16m (AUD 26m) p/a. That's less than double what we are presently on, and that's fitba mad Scotland.

It might be that down the track, we will need to cut back on wages, move to cheaper venues and focus on sustainability rather than growth.

 

[Muppet]

With so many clubs falling on financial difficulties it shows that the FFA setup for ALeague clubs is flawed.
How can so many self made businessmen (owners) get it wrong?

I think it is a combination of the two. There are not too many clubs in the NRL or AFL who turn a profit either however the key difference is that they all have licenced clubs to assist with the revenue. You have a look at them and they all bleed about 1-5 million a year. The licenced club and the pay TV deals are what sustains them.

IMO the original FFA pay TV deal was too long, undervalued and with next to no income coming back to the clubs from the deal.

The conditions placed on the clubs in terms of stadia also contributes significantly to the bottom line. There appeared to be a rush to get the biggest stadium in the belief that the masses would follow. Turns out not to be the case with some clubs now bleeding money as a result of this. Roar playing out of Suncorp is a perfect example. They are charged a premium to use the government controlled stadium for little return. Would be better playing out of Ballymore.

If I am correct one of the key recommendations out of the Crawford report was for the A League to be a separate entity from the FFA. This has not happened yet and is perhaps another reason why clubs are losing money. Unfortunately I can't see this ever happening. Lowy (FFA) refuses to give up his grip on the A League and its revenue. It only perpetuates the issue as the next person who comes in will want to feather their next and do the same thing so to speak. Does this lead us down the path to the same old problems which necessitated the Crawford Report in the first place. Time will tell I guess.

So getting back to my first point, irrespective of whether it is a flawed business model all codes are facing the same credit issues. Until such time as there is a renegotiated Pay TV and FTA deal and clubs have their own licenced premises I think the league will always continue to struggle. It is how well it is managed and whether crowds continue to grow. My two cents.

 

[Nathan Byrn]

The increase in Pay TV deal will only lead to players or more accurately player agent's asking for more dollars to play. It will help but not long term. I don't really want to go into great detail about the Mariners situation, the FFA set the criteria and we got a gig in the A-League. As global financial pressure's mount and the impact of new taxes into our market's bite hard the future does look difficult for survival. "if we build it, they will come" is not a business plan.

 

[dibo]

Taxes? We don't make profits so we don't pay tax.

 

[Nathan Byrn]

Taxes? We don't make profits so we don't pay tax.

Come on Dibo......
1.The people that attend the games pay taxes
2.The sponsors that support the game pay taxes
3.Suppliers pay taxes

Let's not turn this into a political argument.

 

[dibo]

You've claimed that taxes are somehow a new problem. Explain how.

 

[bikinigirl]

. the mining tax will mean our mining magnate/overlord benefactor will get all sooky and stop indulging in our team


.... oh wait a minute

 

[Nathan Byrn]

You've claimed that taxes are somehow a new problem. Explain how.

If you would like to discuss the impact of the proposed new taxes your more than welcome to make an appointment with me. Call me at FMS Group and ask to speak to a Carbon Accountant.
If a prospective investor in The Mariners was to come from say the Manufacturing, Construction or Mining sector's then I would think for the forseeable future they may be having thoughts as to where their dollar goes! And as I alluded earlier a good solid business plan is required for all business. With reference to the carbon tax and not just the tax but the requirement's to provide a GHG inventory many in these sectors are having to adjust their objectives and principles to a more "green" way of thinking. In the majority of instances this can lead to an "initial" outflow of cash to fund improvements and new materials etc. This means less dollars for other area's of their business. And whilst there re-writing their business plan and having to re-think their direction have a guess what the two most least thought of area's of expenditure are?
Sponsorship and Marketing!

 

[dibo]

So business is going to be distracted from sponsorships, and they'll have some transitional costs.

Prepare for armageddon people!

 

[Nathan Byrn]

Not so much "armageddon", but the "some" transitional costs are what we are able to measure. In the majority of instances these costs are crippling and have not been factored into the current business model. And yes they will be distracted from sponsorships and even contra deals in some cases. They are all part of the carbon footprint.