The Finals (how a top 6 works)

[LFCMariners]

I value winning the season more than winning the Grand Final. Only reason I would like to see us win the GF is so there is no blank spot on the CV, and we can say we have won everything on offer.

There is a reason no noteworthy League in the world has a Grand Final, and that is because soccer is a game with such a small margin for error that many times the best team doesn't win on the day. Indeed, a team can lose thanks to a blatant refereeing error. Imagine if 'Hand of Frog' happens in the Grand Final next year!!! In a game like League, more points are scored, scoring is much easier so the better team usually wins, and usually does so in the Grand Final.

But in our sport, the best team is almost always the one who finishes the season on top of the table. With a 6 team finals series, we could have a result where team # 6 finishes 12 points shy of the Premiers, then goes into the finals series and has a good, injury-free run and some crucial refs' calls go their way. They make it to the Grand Final against the Premiers and score early off a penalty that should never have been given. Then the Premiers have a player blatantly taken out in goal but the ref goes Col. Klink on awarding a penalty. The team who placed 6th win after the 90 minutes and are suddenly classed as 'Champions' Where is the logic in that???

Scrap the finals, model the league on the traditional European format and bring in an FFA Cup instead.

 

[MrCelery]

I value winning the season more than winning the Grand Final. Only reason I would like to see us win the GF is so there is no blank spot on the CV, and we can say we have won everything on offer.

There is a reason no noteworthy League in the world has a Grand Final, and that is because soccer is a game with such a small margin for error that many times the best team doesn't win on the day. Indeed, a team can lose thanks to a blatant refereeing error. Imagine if 'Hand of Frog' happens in the Grand Final next year!!! In a game like League, more points are scored, scoring is much easier so the better team usually wins, and usually does so in the Grand Final.

...snip

What short memories we have.

Don't forget we lost to our bitterest enemies in our last Grand Final due in part to a critical 'Hand of Scum' incident in the final minutes. Again, the ref and assistant missed what most of the stadium saw.

Lead to Danny being crucified.

 

[serious14]

Ugh..... I dislike the very concept of a finals series in football - it just doesn't feel right.

. no interest in cups then ... i have heard about a finals series next year that is pretty popular ... does that feel right?

FFA Cup would be perfect.  Cup competitions are awesome.

A season the length it is now, with a couple of rounds of cup capers (state teams included etc.), with the Cup Final played the weekend after the season proper finishes.

One can hope....

 

[Arabmariner]

Don't get me wrong.

I'd like to win the toilet seat......I just think it's wrong the way it's perceived to be the ultimate achievement in Australian football.......that's what winning the league should be.

The league winners should be the "champions/premiers"......they are the same thing.

GF winners are no more than the cup winners imo.

 

[MagpieMariner]

This is Australia and Australian team sports have traditionally had finals series since organised sport first started well over 100 years ago. Bear in mind that until WW2 most Aussies were of British background and would therefore be familiar with first-past-the-post, but still organised their comps with finals. There isn't a team sport in this country without a finals series.
Most Australians love their finals and would be very disappointed if there weren't any. If you want to convert non-followers into followers you'll need a finals series (among other attractions).
I agree that the team in front after the regular season is the best team and much should be made of their achievement, but don't do away with finals. The reason that the finals get the best crowds is because people like them.
Don't call them finals if you don't want to, don't even go and see them if they offend you, but if you want the A-league to expand it's support base to include new converts like me (and it will need to do that to survive) then  keep the finals. Question: why did the grand final a couple of years ago attract 35K to see the Mariners play the scum? Answer: Because it was a grand final. I am very certain there has never been a crowd that size to see any other match between the two, and unless it's a final you won't see it again in a long time. The "traditional European format" might be fine in Europe, but this ain't Europe.

 

[MagpieMariner]

[snip]
The league winners should be the "champions/premiers"......they are the same thing.

GF winners are no more than the cup winners imo.

As I pointed out in my earlier post, from the Australian sporting viewpoint, they are NOT the same thing.
And you will NOT persuade the majority of sport followers that they are. Because for most of us, for most of our lives, we have looked on the grand final as the pinnacle of the season, no matter what our preferred code.
I'm afraid you're just going to have to learn to live with finals, they ain't going to go away in Australia.

 

[bikinigirl]

I value winning the season more than winning the Grand Final. Only reason I would like to see us win the GF is so there is no blank spot on the CV, and we can say we have won everything on offer.

There is a reason no noteworthy League in the world has a Grand Final, and that is because soccer is a game with such a small margin for error that many times the best team doesn't win on the day. Indeed, a team can lose thanks to a blatant refereeing error. Imagine if 'Hand of Frog' happens in the Grand Final next year!!! In a game like League, more points are scored, scoring is much easier so the better team usually wins, and usually does so in the Grand Final.

...snip

What short memories we have.

Don't forget we lost to our bitterest enemies in our last Grand Final due in part to a critical 'Hand of Scum' incident in the final minutes. Again, the ref and assistant missed what most of the stadium saw.

Lead to Danny being crucified.

. and in v1 i would argue that the better team on the day did not win







. but we did that from fourth :ashamed:

 

[MagpieMariner]

I value winning the season more than winning the Grand Final. Only reason I would like to see us win the GF is so there is no blank spot on the CV, and we can say we have won everything on offer.

There is a reason no noteworthy League in the world has a Grand Final, and that is because soccer is a game with such a small margin for error that many times the best team doesn't win on the day. Indeed, a team can lose thanks to a blatant refereeing error. Imagine if 'Hand of Frog' happens in the Grand Final next year!!! In a game like League, more points are scored, scoring is much easier so the better team usually wins, and usually does so in the Grand Final.

...snip

What short memories we have.

Don't forget we lost to our bitterest enemies in our last Grand Final due in part to a critical 'Hand of Scum' incident in the final minutes. Again, the ref and assistant missed what most of the stadium saw.

Lead to Danny being crucified.

. and in v1 i would argue that the better team on the day did not win







. but we did that from fourth :ashamed:

And if memory serves me correct, in V1 the best team didn't even make the GF.

However in V2 & V4, the best team got through and won very easily (V2) and comfortably (V4).

That's the way it is in finals, and that's what makes them so exciting (IMO). However the FFA agrees with most (all?) on here that the best team should go to Asia as well as the GF winner (if they are different).
So football has the right outlook on the best team over the season. Other codes forget who was "minor premier" as soon as the finals start, unless they do a St George with a spectacular choke.

 

[Jesus]

There should be a warning on all these threads that they will undoubtably return to the same debate, with same points on why we should drop/keep the finals.

 

[LFCMariners]

I value winning the season more than winning the Grand Final. Only reason I would like to see us win the GF is so there is no blank spot on the CV, and we can say we have won everything on offer.

There is a reason no noteworthy League in the world has a Grand Final, and that is because soccer is a game with such a small margin for error that many times the best team doesn't win on the day. Indeed, a team can lose thanks to a blatant refereeing error. Imagine if 'Hand of Frog' happens in the Grand Final next year!!! In a game like League, more points are scored, scoring is much easier so the better team usually wins, and usually does so in the Grand Final.

...snip

What short memories we have.

Don't forget we lost to our bitterest enemies in our last Grand Final due in part to a critical 'Hand of Scum' incident in the final minutes. Again, the ref and assistant missed what most of the stadium saw.

Lead to Danny being crucified.

I know, but it wasn't blatant like what Henry or even Diego did. My point is, imagine if it WAS that blatant...

 

[~Floss~]

[snip]
The league winners should be the "champions/premiers"......they are the same thing.

GF winners are no more than the cup winners imo.

As I pointed out in my earlier post, from the Australian sporting viewpoint, they are NOT the same thing.
And you will NOT persuade the majority of sport followers that they are. Because for most of us, for most of our lives, we have looked on the grand final as the pinnacle of the season, no matter what our preferred code.
I'm afraid you're just going to have to learn to live with finals, they ain't going to go away in Australia.

What about the FA CUP Final and the World CUP Final?
In Australia these events are still viewed by the less-faithful (i.e. part-time) sporting public & media in similar numbers to what you would expect from an equivalent Grand Final.

IMO call it a cup, make it in some way a separate title to the "A-League Championship", and everyone is happy - traditional football fans will stop this debate, and the media and partially-interested public still get an annual "Final".

 

[tim...]

If we maintain our form there's no reason we can't collect the plate. Melbourne and Sydney have both shown worrying signs over recent weeks.

 

[LFCMariners]

Would be good to win the double! 2 Premiers plates, a toilet seat, a Pre-season cup trophy and no wooden spoons would look pretty good in comparison to that scum up the F3.

 

[MagpieMariner]

Would be good to win the double! 2 Premiers plates, a toilet seat, a Pre-season cup trophy and no wooden spoons would look pretty good in comparison to that scum up the F3.

Not too foul compared to the mob DOWN the F3 as well!

 

[Hagar the Horrible]

There are traditional football nations which have had finals in the past. A notable example of this is Brazil, which had finals until 2002.

 

[adz]

There are traditional football nations which have had finals in the past. A notable example of this is Brazil, which had finals until 2002.

hmmm come on now, don't let the facts get in the way of everyone's "soccer football is the world game and the whole world does everything better than Australia and Australians are f**king idiots" rant.

 

[LFCMariners]

Wonder why Brazil doesn't have finals series anymore?

It's like Jamie Whincup winning nearly every race in the V8 Supercar season, he gets to Bathurst, starts on pole and then retires with an engine fire during the race. Some bloke who hasn't won a race all season takes the chequered flag and is crowned Supercar champion for the season.

Now of course this isn't the case, but see how ridiculous it sounds?

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Don't think you can get to the GF if you haven't won a game all season

I understand the point though. Always have. But it doesn't mean we still shouldn't have finals.
Just simply means a bigger deal should be made of winning the plate.

But finals are still fun, peak excitement events and I love them. Though leaving the SFS is hell afterwards.

I also have no problems that it is a money spinner. We need all the dosh we can get to help support and grow the clubs and the league so that one day we can have a truly inspirational world class national league.

No one's getting rich off it. So save the angst, and simply get behind what we have imo.

So how does this whole finals thing work exactly ;D

 

[LFCMariners]

I hate the thought that we will be the ones who ultimately lose in the FFA's attempt to reward mediocrity.

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Don't think they are trying to reward mediocrity...
Think they're just trying to cash in on it ;D