Mariners Squad - HAL 14 - 2018- 2019 - The challenge for Mike Mulvey is over

[FFC Mariner]

I might sign on as a member next year but just wait i’m good for the money later. Did you get that Pikey!

Nothing but a cluster F

You spell pikey c**t funny

 

[BrisRecky]

So who do we yell at for not be f**kin motivated enough to get the talks with Miller, Aspro, Painy et all ,going...it’s probably Meikelcamp ain’t it..I mean his at the top of the food chain at Tuggerah right?....so, f**k YOU SHAUN YOU GOOF...am I being too harsh ?

 

[FFC Mariner]

No, 100% his f**k up
He was told to his face that Millar was talking to Lawrie - did nothing

 

[Insertnamehere]

Seriously it's time for clean out of the club. Not just players....

 

[Wombat]

We all love Shaun BUT someone is incompetent. Sure, Pikey is f**kING hopeless but WHO is responsible for Millar going to Scum. Aspro and Pain going to Western Whatever.
And Tommy and Jem not being immediately re-signed for next year.

Its clowns running the circus and Pikey needs to take his big red nose off and start acting like he has a f**king clue.

 

[pjennings]

We all love Shaun BUT someone is incompetent. Sure, Pikey is f**kING hopeless but WHO is responsible for Millar going to Scum. Aspro and Pain going to Western Whatever.
And Tommy and Jem not being immediately re-signed for next year.

Its clowns running the circus and Pikey needs to take his big red nose off and start acting like he has a f**king clue.

I'm not going to bag Shaun for the football department. I know he has been involved in the football side of things this year as no-one else was available - but he shouldn't have been. I'm sure he would tell you that is not his forte. We need a properly running football department so that Shaun can concentrate on his day job.

 

[Ancient Mariner]

The problem is that there is no one doing or having the responsibility to do what needs to be done.

I suspect Shaun was run off his feet trying to keep balls in the air while our sporting director was called back to
Man U. When that happened nothing was done. It was assumed the Man U job was temporary so everyone sat on their hands saying not my responsibility wait until Phelan comes back.
Just a guess but I would bet not wide of the mark.
It is not just on the field that investments in people must be made.

 

[marinermick]

Noticed that Lewis Miller has been in and around the squad lately.

Anyone know much about him. He is a centre back, yeah? What are his best attributes? Does the lad have potential?

 

[Wombat]

Noticed that Lewis Miller has been in and around the squad lately.

Anyone know much about him. He is a centre back, yeah? What are his best attributes? Does the lad have potential?

They played him as RB at training but can also play CB. He looks pretty assured and I would tip him to make the grade. He made his debut for us as RW for a 15-20 cameo possibly in the came Nesbit started.

 

[marinermick]

They played him as RB at training but can also play CB. He looks pretty assured and I would tip him to make the grade. He made his debut for us as RW for a 15-20 cameo possibly in the came Nesbit started.

looks to have a bit of pace about him but did not notice much else because I couldn't really see from my vantage point

 

[turbo]

The problem is that there is no one doing or having the responsibility to do what needs to be done.

I think there's also the issue of waiting so long to sack MM. No doubt they wanted to avoid having to pay him out and hoped he could turn things around. Things got worse and eventually they were forced to but it definitely put us behind in trying to retain players. Sure others could have stepped in but we didnt know who would be running the team and the kind of football they wanted to play.

 

[Coastalraider]

I think there's also the issue of waiting so long to sack MM. No doubt they wanted to avoid having to pay him out and hoped he could turn things around. Things got worse and eventually they were forced to but it definitely put us behind in trying to retain players. Sure others could have stepped in but we didnt know who would be running the team and the kind of football they wanted to play.

Yeah thats a very valid point.

It wouldn't be a popular opinion on here (and not necessarily my opinion, or an educated on!) but there is a possibility that not resigning these players was part of a larger plan.

Lets look at it from a competent owners point of view - you realise you are running out of chances. The manager you have hired with good intention is a wash up, and the majority of your senior players have turned out to be well past the quality of the League. You need to make this next cycle count.

We still dont have a manager signed for next year (although with the recent rumours and renewals it looks like Stajic has it, even if it hasnt been announced yet) - it would be a fairly sensible plan of attack to hold off player negotiations until this part is finalised, as we really cant afford a manager being hamstrung by a squad that doesn't suit their philosophy any more than necessary. If we are 100% honest, none of the guys that have signed elsewhere are irreplaceable, even on our budget. Pain may be passionate,and I love the fact he was one of the only blokes that showed that passion, but he is at a Nick Fitzgerald level of talent. Apsro definitely shows potential, but I would MUCH rather replace him with a genuine quality centre back, as Cisse was supposed to be. Millar will be a loss, as RB are not simple to source, but there was a lot of unknowns at that point in time.

Given that we have heard that with both Millar and Pain intention to retain was given, it lines up with trying to finalise management plans prior to player retention. Given our level of attractiveness in the League, I can understand why players would sign elsewhere, even if we had shown intent. But also given how screwed up our football department has proven to be this year, I can also see us trying to solidify that component first.

And lets not forget it has come out that we ere essentially taken for a ride by a certain player manager this season - having some backbone and not being bullied into signing fringe players may actually be a positive.

 

[turbo]

The manager you have hired with good intention is a wash up

Great post, totally agree. I think it's worth noting they did sign a manager with a decent reputation and we know how it turned out. Not sure how much say he had in recruitment but there were some very questionable calls there they cant afford to repeat. As you say Pain is decent but not operating at a level we can't replace, it's more that he was one of the few performing at the level the whole squad should have been at. The wing seems to be one of the spots where youth gets a run too, maybe a bit more forgiving to the odd stuff up. It also opens up that left wing for Oar.

Aspro is a loss but as I've said elsewhere I believe we can only afford to play Aspro or Rowles in CB. We need an experienced leader in there to take charge of the back line and bring out the best in the likes of Clisby, Rowles/Aspro and whoever we recruit for RB. RB typically isnt a big spending position so they'll likely benefit from experience beside them too. If we've identified that we have more of a shot at locking in Rowles and have already locked in Clisby it makes sense to let Aspro go even if we don't really want to.

 

[shipwreck]

Yeah thats a very valid point.

It wouldn't be a popular opinion on here (and not necessarily my opinion, or an educated on!) but there is a possibility that not resigning these players was part of a larger plan.

Lets look at it from a competent owners point of view - you realise you are running out of chances. The manager you have hired with good intention is a wash up, and the majority of your senior players have turned out to be well past the quality of the League. You need to make this next cycle count.

We still dont have a manager signed for next year (although with the recent rumours and renewals it looks like Stajic has it, even if it hasnt been announced yet) - it would be a fairly sensible plan of attack to hold off player negotiations until this part is finalised, as we really cant afford a manager being hamstrung by a squad that doesn't suit their philosophy any more than necessary. If we are 100% honest, none of the guys that have signed elsewhere are irreplaceable, even on our budget. Pain may be passionate,and I love the fact he was one of the only blokes that showed that passion, but he is at a Nick Fitzgerald level of talent. Apsro definitely shows potential, but I would MUCH rather replace him with a genuine quality centre back, as Cisse was supposed to be. Millar will be a loss, as RB are not simple to source, but there was a lot of unknowns at that point in time.

Given that we have heard that with both Millar and Pain intention to retain was given, it lines up with trying to finalise management plans prior to player retention. Given our level of attractiveness in the League, I can understand why players would sign elsewhere, even if we had shown intent. But also given how screwed up our football department has proven to be this year, I can also see us trying to solidify that component first.

And lets not forget it has come out that we ere essentially taken for a ride by a certain player manager this season - having some backbone and not being bullied into signing fringe players may actually be a positive.

Sorry what happened with the player manager thing?

 

[Coastalraider]

Sorry what happened with the player manager thing?

The coach and the majority of the players all came via the same manager, leading to conflicts of interest.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ll-the-uncertain-role-and-influence-of-agents

 

[Forum Phoenix]

Yeah thats a very valid point.

It wouldn't be a popular opinion on here (and not necessarily my opinion, or an educated on!) but there is a possibility that not resigning these players was part of a larger plan.

Lets look at it from a competent owners point of view - you realise you are running out of chances. The manager you have hired with good intention is a wash up, and the majority of your senior players have turned out to be well past the quality of the League. You need to make this next cycle count.

We still dont have a manager signed for next year (although with the recent rumours and renewals it looks like Stajic has it, even if it hasnt been announced yet) - it would be a fairly sensible plan of attack to hold off player negotiations until this part is finalised, as we really cant afford a manager being hamstrung by a squad that doesn't suit their philosophy any more than necessary. If we are 100% honest, none of the guys that have signed elsewhere are irreplaceable, even on our budget. Pain may be passionate,and I love the fact he was one of the only blokes that showed that passion, but he is at a Nick Fitzgerald level of talent. Apsro definitely shows potential, but I would MUCH rather replace him with a genuine quality centre back, as Cisse was supposed to be. Millar will be a loss, as RB are not simple to source, but there was a lot of unknowns at that point in time.

Given that we have heard that with both Millar and Pain intention to retain was given, it lines up with trying to finalise management plans prior to player retention. Given our level of attractiveness in the League, I can understand why players would sign elsewhere, even if we had shown intent. But also given how screwed up our football department has proven to be this year, I can also see us trying to solidify that component first.

And lets not forget it has come out that we ere essentially taken for a ride by a certain player manager this season - having some backbone and not being bullied into signing fringe players may actually be a positive.

Great post.

I don’t buy that it’s ‘all’ incompetence. I think it’s clearly deliberate. The club got played by Rallis and f**ked up with Millar, but with everyone else, seems pretty obviously a mass clear out is the intention and i think that’s pretty hard to argue with barring only a very small number of players.

We MUST turn the corner, and if I was coming in, with our record, I’d want as fresh a start as possible also.

I’m really hoping for Jem primarily, because while I love Tom, Jem has proven he’s a true leader imo.

But tbh, what would really worry me more than no re-signings... is if we were announcing a whole lot of re-signings.

I’m sorry, but I think our current squad is an imbalanced shambles and regardless of coach, with our current squad I can’t imagine anyone making the top six. And I don’t care what anyone says, a teams ambition should always be to try and win the damn league.

 

[shipwreck]

I still like Tom best, but I have a soft spot for loyalty.

 

[bikinigirl]

Yeah thats a very valid point.

It wouldn't be a popular opinion on here (and not necessarily my opinion, or an educated on!) but there is a possibility that not resigning these players was part of a larger plan.

Lets look at it from a competent owners point of view - you realise you are running out of chances. The manager you have hired with good intention is a wash up, and the majority of your senior players have turned out to be well past the quality of the League. You need to make this next cycle count.

We still dont have a manager signed for next year (although with the recent rumours and renewals it looks like Stajic has it, even if it hasnt been announced yet) - it would be a fairly sensible plan of attack to hold off player negotiations until this part is finalised, as we really cant afford a manager being hamstrung by a squad that doesn't suit their philosophy any more than necessary. If we are 100% honest, none of the guys that have signed elsewhere are irreplaceable, even on our budget. Pain may be passionate,and I love the fact he was one of the only blokes that showed that passion, but he is at a Nick Fitzgerald level of talent. Apsro definitely shows potential, but I would MUCH rather replace him with a genuine quality centre back, as Cisse was supposed to be. Millar will be a loss, as RB are not simple to source, but there was a lot of unknowns at that point in time.

Given that we have heard that with both Millar and Pain intention to retain was given, it lines up with trying to finalise management plans prior to player retention. Given our level of attractiveness in the League, I can understand why players would sign elsewhere, even if we had shown intent. But also given how screwed up our football department has proven to be this year, I can also see us trying to solidify that component first.

And lets not forget it has come out that we ere essentially taken for a ride by a certain player manager this season - having some backbone and not being bullied into signing fringe players may actually be a positive.

. i understand where you're coming from and you have made your points well ... but having a competent owner's POV as the founding premise is a brave step for a Mariners fan

... but this part still undermines the argument - and i can't find any reasonable explanation:

Given that we have heard that with both Millar and Pain intention to retain was given, it lines up with trying to finalise management plans prior to player retention.

. if Millar, Pain (and Aspro) have all been deemed 'worthy of a contract' ... and reports suggest discussions had taken place and/or offers made ... before a manager was appointed - then the rest of your argument doesn't hold (in the true sense of waiting)

. the reality of being too slow ... or stalling to keep our own options open - only suggests that such things will continue until our options are further diminished (which is all too familiar)

... now for my real point* - each of these players have been mentioned in the media as what equates to 'squad fillers' for the teams they have signed for. they have effectively been some of our better players and first eleven (when available) under all (three?) managers

. you'll have to forgive me for not believing that the offers being made were with the intention of utilising these guys as squad fillers for us with a brand new, kick-arse starting eleven

. if the club wants to sign them ... f**king sign them or at least make an offer, a real offer (wiv a contract an' everyfink) - don't string them along with promises until a manager is appointed who may, then potentially say no anyway - we have no right to complain about agents if this is the kinda shit we are doing

* hopefully this is all irrelevant and our new signings suggest that Millar, Pain & Aspro would have struggled to get into the starting eleven next year (which of course will be a moot point because we will never know whether they were intended to be first eleven or not)

 

[Forum Phoenix]

I think people are getting the wrong end of the stick on this one.

And no I’m not defending the club. These are long term effects they’ve brought on us. And I think the problem is a lot worse than the idea they simply can’t get their act together enough to make timely / convincing overtures to players.

I expect much of the hesitation is from the players and their agents. The Australian based ones who are performing well, foremost of which are Aspro and Pain, if they had a decent outside offer and a chance to go would have to be crazy to stay. If Pain and Aspro wanted to be staying, they’d be staying.

No quality player who is sought after, or hopes they might be in the off season is opting in early to the Mariners right now.

We’re in for a hell of a fight to overcome this hurdle. We need to sign and build early but in our current predicament that’s going to be f**king hard to do.

So people may think it must be Phelan and Shaun floundering at every turn, but I think far more likely that what we’re seeing are the result of years of underspending, poor squads, poor coaches and poor results all coming home to roost.

 

[pjennings]

So people may think it must Phelan and Shaun floundering at every turn, but I think far more likely that what we’re seeing are the result of years of underspending, poor squads, poor coaches and poor results all coming home to roost.

Absolutely this - at least in general.

But look at Pain's case form his point of view. He came here for more game time and got it. He was immediately accepted - initially because he replaced Austin who people had turned against and secondly because he came across as a good guy who cared about his performance.

Where he is going he will once again be getting good game time but additionally will be close to friends and family. Even at the same money it is a no-brainer decision - but he probably got a pay rise as well.