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Jedi & Sainsbury

midfielder

Well-Known Member
I remember the year we sold Jedi mid season ... after he left the side kinda fell apart the organisation / defence / just fell apart and to this day me thinks the biggest impact of a lost player we have had ... just maybe Trent is starting to challenge ... We have leaked goals and seem to lack any real organisation from the back and Reddy is appearing lost at times without the calls coming from Trent..

We all knew Trent was good and important to the side ... the question is will his leaving be akin to Jedi .. lets hope not...
 

bikinigirl

Well-Known Member
. interesting observation ... and although i agree the loss of sains has been huge ... we have lost a lot more than 'just' trent this time around

. when jedi left ... and the performances suffered ... so did our crowds. we have just started getting people back (record memberships, etc) ... hence my concern about the number of people observed leaving early the other night

. hopefully we don't have to go through years of re-building crowds again ... the club may not survive that next time
 

dibo

Well-Known Member
There's a difference to our financial baseline though. Our break-even crowd will be lower now, as TV grants are much greater.

08/09: 10,465 - when Jedi left
09/10: 7,430 - our worst ever squad and our worst ever season
10/11: 7,713 - Arnie's first year, when we recovered from an awful season to make the GF
11/12: 9,607 - when we won the league
12/13: 9,921 - when we won the championship
13/14: 9,502 YTD (counting NSO) - when we're a little bit on the slide, but we have 3 derbies to come, and I'd expect each of them to draw better than 10k. If we average better than 11,826, we will go better than 10k by the end of the year for the first time in 5 years. If you take NSO out, we're averaging 9,777 and we need just 10,744 to crack 10k for the year.
14/15: we're going to be rebuilding *and* we won't have home two derbies against each of the other NSW teams.

For what it's worth, if you take out the Fridays (which are an unmitigated disaster for us) and NSO (which is an aberration anyway) then we're averaging 10,730.

If you work from my assumption that the Fridays and NSO were disasters and so replace the crowds we got then our non-derby, non-NYE average (8,653), we're running at 10,163.

I posted some stuff ages back working from some assumptions about cost of running a club, tv money and extrapolating break-even crowds.

On my (*very* back of the envelope) calculations, the break-even crowd might have fallen by as much as 30%, so while a bad year might give us a loss, it might not be catastrophic because we're less crowd-reliant.

We also have a bigger sponsorship profile, which will take further pressure off the gate. Even if our performance is down, our national exposure is *up* compared to that time because the league's exposure is up.

FWIW, I think we'd run a loss this year unless we crack nearly 11k average, but we're not going to average 15k for the three remaining games so that's not going to happen.
 

midfielder

Well-Known Member
. interesting observation ... and although i agree the loss of sains has been huge ... we have lost a lot more than 'just' trent this time around

. when jedi left ... and the performances suffered ... so did our crowds. we have just started getting people back (record memberships, etc) ... hence my concern about the number of people observed leaving early the other night

. hopefully we don't have to go through years of re-building crowds again ... the club may not survive that next time

HHHHmmmmm and so did our crowds .....

In marketing 101 they say understanding your customer base is critical... We have been told that 20% of the membership [crowds normally follow the same relationship] come from Sydney and many of those are from the Northern Spirit base ... meaning ageing and needs to travel a long way .. further meaning a limit to how many poor games they will travel to...

However I tend to agree with Dibo our crowds are growing and will IMO continue to grow as long as we start to play HHHHMMmmmmmmm will not like recently..

Back to Trent .. prior to his leaving we had the equal second best defence in the League we have leaked goals since he left ... me thinks he may have been the main caller on the park telling the DM who and where to cover and covering the mistakes as well as directing the positional play of the other backs...

An old management saying is never follow [if you can help it] a highly successful manager .. always try to follow a dud ... if you are successful but not quite as good you look like a failure and yet a small success following a Dud makes you look a champion... Mossey must be wondering what to do but it can't be easy following Arnie ...
 
Last edited:

Roy Law

Well-Known Member
Jedi essentially took the team with him when he left because he was the team when he left; this season the team had left before Trent departed. Even with Trent we should have been spanked by Nix at NSO and we did lose 0-4 to Adelaide. I would still like him in Korea right now though!
 

bikinigirl

Well-Known Member
. dibo i agree about the crowds and their relative importance to the break-even point. the real issue for our survival though is what the owner wants in order for us to survive ... and crowd numbers seem important to him

. early departures (from the crowd and team) indicate worrying signs for next season's membership and crowd numbers
 

bikinigirl

Well-Known Member
. regarding sains though ... i still think he was under-rated by many of the mariners supporters with perhaps too much credit flowing to big pat. don't get me wrong, the big fella was a worthy recipient of praise but sometimes i think his reputation may have over-shadowed his partner

. the same could be said for wilko - who i think was under-rated by many mariners fans. his loss was covered by, arguably, a better better footballer in trent. i would rate both of these guys as exceptionally 'clean' defenders ... and as such they probably don't receive the coverage their 'quiet' game deserves
 

Big Al

Well-Known Member
Yes 100%

Trent has saved us time & time again in the 1st half of the season.

He covered storm ( a rookie) so well storm looked great. I don't think storm has played as well without him.

The start of the year it was a left CB we kept swapping & changing - Which has continued
but now Trent's quality has been replaced by another up & comer. Zac is looking better each week. Last week there was a one on one with an AU attacker inside the box & Zac positioned himself perfectly & made the block at the right time it was the best defence I'd seen in a long time not performed by Trent. Give him time he will be good to.

At the end of the day Jedi now leads CPalace & would be in the mix to lead the socceroos in Brazil. You don't just replace that quality (even if he wasn't that good then but was on the up).
Trent is now talked of as a socceroo potentially & you don't replace him easily but especially in the last days of the transfer window.

Storm - 10 to 15 A League games - Got a go for NZ due to his potential - Very young
Zac - 10 to 15 A league games - Swapped from left to right - Still young looks promising
Eddie - 3 A league games - Very experienced defender - Bit slow not match fit
Rosey - Only one who has been there done that - Looking not quite himself this year.

A couple of weeks training doesn't patch over experience but give em time they can gel but it might be to late to give this year a shake. Which Eddie would be the only one not a definite for next years back 4.
 

gull

Well-Known Member
I remember the year we sold Jedi mid season ... after he left the side kinda fell apart the organisation / defence / just fell apart and to this day me thinks the biggest impact of a lost player we have had ... just maybe Trent is starting to challenge ... We have leaked goals and seem to lack any real organisation from the back and Reddy is appearing lost at times without the calls coming from Trent..

We all knew Trent was good and important to the side ... the question is will his leaving be akin to Jedi .. lets hope not...

I was thinking about exactly this on the weekend.

Perhaps Sainsbury had been "papering over the cracks" with his reading of the game, and now that he is no longer there the cracks have opened up.

Maybe we're only just starting to appreciate how important he was to our defence.
 

eenfish

Well-Known Member
Brent Griffiths need to be given a run. Either tomorrow or on the weekend. Plus with Sim showing real fire in a squad severely lacking it and Rose's performances of late imply his position isn't as secure as it once was.
 

nebakke

Well-Known Member
I think it might be worth giving either Griff2 or Seip a chance again.... But in place of Bosnar, not Ando... I was thinking something along the lines of maybe starting Chesty and Griff2 with perhaps Seip ready as a stand-in for one of them if we concede more than 1... Not necessarily because he'll be better at the game as such, but because I'd hope that he'd have a bit of grit to try to keep it going.
I know there's heaps of dislike for him and I see why, but I think he's been off long enough for it to be worth another go, especially in light of how he seemed to have a bit of interest and energy when he came on at the end of the Adelaide game.
 

VicMariner

Well-Known Member
Seip played in the Eredivisie so he has something about him. Maybe an important game against very strong opposition is what he needs to kick him into gear?
Same with Bosnar.
They have the experience and quality. Lifting for a "big one" and having a good game might give them back some confidence.
 

eenfish

Well-Known Member
Seip played in the Eredivisie so he has something about him. Maybe an important game against very strong opposition is what he needs to kick him into gear?
Same with Bosnar.
They have the experience and quality. Lifting for a "big one" and having a good game might give them back some confidence.

From his wiki:
Seip also scored three goals against RKC Waalwijk and SC Heerenveen (both fixtures in the league). Seip became the highest scoring defender in the Eredivisie and quickly established himself as a fans favourite due to his no nonsense approach to defending.

If we could see that player it'd be great. All we get is some guy who looks disinterested and unmotivated.
 

Big Al

Well-Known Member

awblade

Member
When we (Sheff Utd) had Seip on loan, I wouldn't have minded making him a permanent signing as a back up player. That is when we were in the Championship doing quite well too. Saying that he did only play a few games for us
 

Big Al

Well-Known Member
When we (Sheff Utd) had Seip on loan, I wouldn't have minded making him a permanent signing as a back up player. That is when we were in the Championship doing quite well too. Saying that he did only play a few games for us
Maybe it's just age that has caught him short.
Appears his reactions are a little to slow fouling when the ball isn't there to get or the player is past him.
His touch is shit. But he played agressive & assertive on Tuesday night. Might have just thought heck go for gold otherwise i'm back on the bench
 

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