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Crawford ----Is it still Important.

midfielder

Well-Known Member
I wrote this as much for discussion as anything else ... hope you enjoy ...

It is said if you forget the lessons of history you will repeat the same mistakes

Arguablely  the Crawford report was the most significant report on Football in Australia.

The report left no doubt about the root cause of where football found itself Broke, Corrupt, Inept Management, few if any national polices driven and run by self interest .. the core of the problems lie in the management team and management structure with a national competition run by clubs who base support was ethnic driven.

There where numerous over reporting and over reactions to these clubs. Simon Hills famous article Can you Smell the Fear was based on one such reporting of a Sydney United game when race riots ( what race riots is more to the point) were reported massively in the press but at the RL match the same day more than ten times the arrest were made without even a mention in the media.

However where there is smoke there is fire and without doubt the behaviour of some fans at some of the old NSL ethnic based clubs let the main stream media take pot shots at Football.

I have often said Football caused its own problems in the past. This has lead to the uneasy feeling between Old Soccer & New Football.

Without doubt the traditional mainstream media that supports  the AFL & NRL would love some of those old NSL stories.. it could do enormous damage to link new football and old soccer riots with A-League FA Cup crowd behaviour together

Many critics and long term football fans have asked nay begged, now demand, that the old NSL clubs be brought back into the fold.. The much mooted FA Cup is often seen as the way to unite the old and the new

SBS often run articles outlining the need to unite and how beneficial this will be. In this light I was reading and SBS blog on the need for an FA cup and a poster posted the following comment.

I'm one of the many old NSL supporters who now follows an A-League club and the A-League in general and I'm still not convinced, 6 years on, that the danger of our sport shooting itself in the foot one more (and perhaps for the last time) has disappeared. To this day my old club Sydney Olympic is still supported only by Greeks, Sydney United only by Croatians, APIA by Italians and so on. Is that fact more acceptable today than back in 2004 when our successful A-League was created without the inclusion of mono-ethnic clubs and is it in the long-term interests of our sport to throw these mono-ethnic clubs a lifeline by re-engaging them in a national-type competition once again? The newer followers of our national competition wouldn't know how dangerous or even fatal for our sport that might prove to be, but us older supporters know from bitter experience that the old saying "soccer always manages to shoot itself in the foot" is just an innocuous move like this one away.

The question I ask is are the clubs & fans of the more hard core NSL clubs ready to abide by the crowd behaviour rules including national slogans issues.

My own interpretation is  Frank Lowy & the FFA are terrified of what the press will do to football if ever a major crowd behaviour incident took place ( and I think they are not wrong). I remember MV & SFC supporters simply chanting was reported in the Melbourne press as a riot. I guess one of the reasons FFA are so strict on Home Ends but that is another article in itself.

In any family for a reunion to take place there needs to be some recognitation of sins of the past and some kinda resolution that we accept we did wrong and will not do the bad stuff again.

My reading of the Tea Leafs is as football grows its media has to grow as well in this respect SBS could be a great deal of help. SBS has history and many connections with the NSL clubs, SBS has never admitted (because it encouraged) the NSL ethnic based clubs did anything wrong,  and often writes about the benefits the NSL clubs could bring to the FFA. SBS never talk about the other side of the coin what harm some of the still ethnic clubs could do.

SBS could lead the NSL clubs to a place where the risk of an incident or incidents that could damage football where very minor, present this to FFA and help unite the tribes.  This would be good for Football and good for SBS...
 

Jesus

Jesus
I think that there is a common misconception that ex nsl supporters, of ethnic clubs, have no interest in the a-league.

I also think there numbers are heavily increased.

I think that having clubs based solely on ethnic origin is always going to cause problems. The same problems that 2 sets of opposition always face, but when it is 2 ethnicities the slander is likely to be as racially divided as the 2 camps are. Same prioblem happens at the tennis.

At no time would i expect in this country, that if 3 italians fight 3 serbs that it would not be called racially motivated. There are yobs in every crowd, but when a club is ethnically based it just sets itself up for having these yobs reasons for fighting being racial.

Football owes a debt to the old nsl, and not just the ethnic clubs. But every football fan who suffered under the slander that was directed at the sport, in no small part due to the ethnicities of many teams, is owed more from those teams.

We dont need old european based ethnic clubs any more than we need new indian or chinese or afgahni clubs.

Football is meant to be inclusive, of everyone. It is long time that these clubs left their ethnicities in the social clubs, and became inclusive in football. IMO

Since inclusiveness is what they seek
 

FFC Mariner

Well-Known Member
Well said.

SBS's bitterness towards all things HAL will have surely been noted by the FFA and as for ethnic clubs?

Because it will be impossible for them to be part of the HAL without bringing their "baggage" with them, they must be kept out.
 

Forum Phoenix

Well-Known Member
Very well said midfielder.

Wholeheartedly agree. Be nice for SBS to actually contribute in a more positive and active fashion to our domestic football landscape again.
 

MagpieMariner

Well-Known Member
Many of us native-born Aussies who followed (and still follow) Aussie Rules and Rugby League weren't interested in "wogball" in the past have come to follow football (in part) because the ethnic influence, at least in the HAL, is no longer there. Allow the perception that it's coming back and a good number of us will be gone.
 

Roy Law

Well-Known Member
Its not quite on subject but as someone who didn't follow the NSL (because I thought it was awful, in so many ways) but embraces the A League, can anyone tell me why with such deeply entrenched ethnic identities in 'old soccer' it is the British influence that gets the blame for Australia's inability to produce technically gifted footballers?
 

Roy Law

Well-Known Member
As for an FA Cup style competition - very difficult to fit into an increasingly congested A League schedule. The comp will expand to twelve teams, there are international breaks and the ACL so the only time is pre season which allows the state comps to provide their participants in the FFA Cup. If it were to happen there would need to be elimination rounds to reduce 'non-league' contestants to 4 to add to the 12 for a round of 16; then based on a knock out format. This is essentially unworkable as it would mean many A League clubs wouldn't take it seriously as it would be pre season. It's a lovely idea to bring together the old and the new but I think it is unlikely to happen amy time soon.
 

dibo

Well-Known Member
Roy Law said:
Its not quite on subject but as someone who didn't follow the NSL (because I thought it was awful, in so many ways) but embraces the A League, can anyone tell me why with such deeply entrenched ethnic identities in 'old soccer' it is the British influence that gets the blame for Australia's inability to produce technically gifted footballers?

Because SBS apparently feel they can't possibly go and bag the shit out of the clubs and supporters that they fed and fed them for 25 years before the HAL.

The problem isn't with one ethnicity or another, it's the completely amateur hodgepodge of technical programs. There has never (until now) been a consistent theme or an underlying set of principles to technical development in this country. The whole system, not any particular ethnicity, has been the problem.

As football is increasingly professional at the elite level, so is the technical development. Coaches are being trained with certain principles in mind and are learning to instil technique and tactics into players from an early age. The system is national, so every player should come through to senior level in time fully conversant in the many variants of the '1-4-3-3' (the FFA seems to see a need to specify that there should be a goalkeeper, as if the 0-4-4-3 might be an option...).
 

kevrenor

Well-Known Member
Roy Law said:
Its not quite on subject but as someone who didn't follow the NSL (because I thought it was awful, in so many ways) but embraces the A League, can anyone tell me why with such deeply entrenched ethnic identities in 'old soccer' it is the British influence that gets the blame for Australia's inability to produce technically gifted footballers?
I do not comment on how correct the assertion is that 'British influence that gets the blame for Australia's inability to produce technically gifted footballers', especially as 'central' European influences at semi-pro level developed a lot of our current Socceroos - however in simplistic terms it may be because the so called 'British' influence was at Association level (ie. amatuer) and among the coaching development hierarchies of Soccer Australia and the state federations.
 

MrCelery

Well-Known Member
Let's not forget that the NSL was not just made up of ethnic clubs.

Having said that, I miss the regular 'match ups' with the overtly ethnic teams like the Croatias, the Greeks, the Maltese, the Italians. The punch ups, threats of stabbings, stoning of buses, threats of violence, sales of videos promoting foreign wars at the gates, etc.

But then I'm a sicko!

Seriously - couldn't fault their passion, nor their contribution to football, but gone, not forgotten, but not missed.
 

kevrenor

Well-Known Member
MrCelery said:
Let's not forget that the NSL was not just made up of ethnic clubs.

Having said that, I miss the regular 'match ups' with the overtly ethnic teams like the Croatias, the Greeks, the Maltese, the Italians. The punch ups, threats of stabbings, stoning of buses, threats of violence, sales of videos promoting foreign wars at the gates, etc.

But then I'm a sicko!

Seriously - couldn't fault their passion, nor their contribution to football, but gone, not forgotten, but not missed.

Ah, memories.

I remember the Rowdies at King Tom, and the big navy guy patrolling no man's land between the Croatian fans (wearing shirts advertising a dance coming up ... with AK47's on it) and us. I just said if there's trouble I'm just running ... you guys are all younger than me!

My mum says that when I was in a double stroller with my twin brother in the early 1950's she had to pick the whole thing up and run, at a game at Wonoona Oval, on the Illawarra - before Croats, Serbs, etc. were let in the the competition - there was passion in those days!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHlsIy812kU

A very famous incident at Pratten Park, with Marshall Soper interviewed
 

goingtoadisco

Well-Known Member
Good video, my dad also used to go to games at woonona when he was young.

That video really reminded me of what football was like before the crawford report. The lack of recognition, the lack of coverage. I still remember not wanting to take a soccer ball to school in fear of being hassled about folowing it!

I can understand why people feel that we should recognice the old NSL clubs, but persoanly i dont care if they fade away into obscurity. They were the ones that made the game secluded, they were the ones that put there own personal agendas infront of the game.

I love the idea of an Australian FA cup, it is such an excitieing prospect, but that video just reminids me of the dark ages.
 

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